Creeper Vacuum

[thepenguin]

But shouldn't they to vacuum?

no

[UpperKEES]

But shouldn't they to vacuum?

The makers probably use an on board microrift that has been opened into the vacuum of space and intercepting the Creeper before it escapes. MR's don't require energy to operate either.

[Ebon Heart]

One note about the hybrid model.  To make an effective burst, I have to make the ore storage upgrade rather large compared to its current value.  Right now you start at 20 and can upgrade by 40 up to 5 times.  I need to change that to be something more like start at 50 and then each upgrade increases storage by 500.
That would top you out at 2550 storage.  This can hold more than the total ore on some maps. 

At 2550, you could burst 2550*30k = 76500k = 76.5 Million creeper in an instant.

I just changed my vote.

So did I! :)

[Krell]

I still prefer the pipes idea.

[CobraKill]

I wan the creeper Vaccum and the pipes. Both would be fun to mess with  ;D I personally think the pipes should be used to move around and olny the maker that sucks up the creeper can expell it again. Then we could have pipes and still have burst, which is all I want  :)

[Krell]

no point in pipes if can just teleport AC everywhere. The vacuum lacks a chance for things to go wrong, two makers at different points and you're pretty much just teleporting it all elsewhere rather than through pipes which could be hit by creeper or drones and spring a leak.

[thepenguin]

what I want is a teleporter, no pipes, no ore, 2 makers linked, 1 way creeper flow

[UpperKEES]

no point in pipes if can just teleport AC everywhere. The vacuum lacks a chance for things to go wrong, two makers at different points and you're pretty much just teleporting it all elsewhere rather than through pipes which could be hit by creeper or drones and spring a leak.

I think you overestimate the power of anti-Creeper. It's not that important. Your other weapons supply much more fire power. When you still like to play around with 'pipes', just use repulsors or make a nice map with fields moving (both kinds of) Creeper around.

what I want is a teleporter, no pipes, no ore, 2 makers linked, 1 way creeper flow

That's what the hybrid solution does. The fact that it goes through to ore storage is something that doesn't matter (although it determines the amount of Creeper you can burst at once).

[Cotters]

What would happen if a wall block that has anti-creeper trapped in it, is passed over by a vacuuming maker? dose it get sucked up, or is it still in the box?(of cores it doesn't matter tho  :))

Simple logic will allow you to figure this out. Makers absorb only A-C in the cell they are in. Since they can never pass over terrain, they will not affect entombed A-C.

I think he means AC trapped in shields.

Yup. thank you Krell, i did mean shields
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[Ebon Heart]

The 'hybrid' model that has come out of this discussion is this:
-Makers vacuum up Anti-Creeper and turn it into ore (like option 1)
-Makers have a 'burst' button that will dump instantly the entire ore stash into anti-creeper.
-I increase the benefit of the ore storage tech upgrade.  So you could have up to say 2000 stored ore.

The conversion rate of ore to creeper is 1:30000.  One ore makes thirty thousand creeper.  This means that 2000 ore wound make 60000000 (60 million) creeper.

Now you still have to mine that 2000 ore... but this is true in any model.  Basically, the burst button is just another kind of emission setting.  You have (1x, 2x, 4x, Burst).  Sometimes you would use a Maker just as you currently do, to provide support for an assault by creating anti-creeper at the rate you are producing it.  At other times you might decide to wait and store up ore so that you can burst emit it at the right time and location.

Vacuuming up creeper in this model turns it back into ore.  You can now use that ore to slowly emit anti-creeper via 1-4x settings, or you can emit it all as anti-creeper all at once using the burst button.

This seems like it might provide the most benefits discussed with few negatives... but maybe I have overlooked something. Thoughts on the hybrid model?  I will add it as an option to the poll.

That could change gameplay a little... does that mean you can have say, 8 ore rigs or something, and have one maker set to burst so that it will spit out any ore that's produced right away? And will the burst setting also use up processed ore? (whatever you call it... the crystal energy of ore) And the pipes idea could still be very helpful for custom maps, maybe if you have creeper and anti-creeper pipes?

[Krell]

creeper pipes are called fields =P and no. remnant ore must be processed into AC then vacuumed up before being burstable

[thepenguin]

how about we just get rid of pipes, tanks, and converting back to ore?

make makers be "Greeper teleporters" and have them send it between each other, no problems with burst, no problems with story, and then you can just have a really dense "Greeper pile" and have makers "send" and "receive" greeper to and from the pile?

[knucracker]

That could change gameplay a little... does that mean you can have say, 8 ore rigs or something, and have one maker set to burst so that it will spit out any ore that's produced right away? And will the burst setting also use up processed ore? (whatever you call it... the crystal energy of ore) And the pipes idea could still be very helpful for custom maps, maybe if you have creeper and anti-creeper pipes?

Bursting would be a manual process.  You would have to select a maker and click a burst button.  When you did this, it would instantly convert all ore (not remnant ore, just the ore in your stash) into anti-creeper.  Might there be a small penalty for doing this?  Perhaps.  The burst conversion from ore to anti-creeper might be around 10% less efficient than any of the 1x,2x,4x settings.

Vacuuming would convert anti-creeper back into ore.  This process is 1 to 1.  So if you emit anti-creeper, vacuum it, emit it again (never bursting) you may not lose any... though it you could lose some due to evaporation if you let it flow around outside a confined area.

Neither vacuuming or bursting are required elements for game play (we don't have either right now).  The original idea for a game play extension was a vacuum concept.  This can still be done in the absence of providing bursting.  Bursting came about as a result of an initial beta implementation for vacuuming.  In this beta implementation a maker could vacuum up anti-creeper and store X amount of it in a _local_ tank.  I had a "release" button that would dump the tank.  I observed that this was kind of fun to play with... hence the current idea of bursting.

My plan right now is to implement vacuum hybrid mode (anti-creeper back into ore).  I will also add a few burst buttons (10%, 25%, 100%) to makers.  I think this model could make sense, and is worth implementing and trying.  After that, I'll evaluate the state of affairs and try to decide what is best.

[Thommuz]

Why don't you make the vacuüm cleaner option more like a gravity field? This way all the creeper close enough to the creeper maker will close in on it and this way you can also collect creeper.

It will create situations where creeper will stack up arrount the creeper maker, and enabling you to sent the creeper maker with a huge stack of creeper around it into an aere with enemy creeper. There you could release the sucking function and the friendly creeper will spread again.

[Ebon Heart]

I like the idea of bursting, I really do. I was just thinking about some of the possible downfalls to it. It might change times on a few days at the least.