Capping emitters

[UpperKEES]

I'm into creating my own maps now and try to fine tune my emitters to the following conditions:

1. It should be able to cap them by one or two blasters.
2. The creeper should reach a certain point on my map at a certain time if not intervened by the player.

To get condition 2 working I can't just increase the intensity and/or decrease the interval because of condition 1, so I have a limit. To determine this limit I started testing with the following results:

Interval   Intensity   # Blasters   Capped?
0.1            1                  1                  No
0.1            2                  1                  No
0.1            3                  1                  No
0.1            4                  1                  No
0.1            5                  1                  No
0.1            1                  2                  Yes
0.1            2                  2                  Yes
0.1            3                  2                  Yes
0.1            4                  2                  Yes
0.1            5                  2                  Yes
0.2            1                  1                  Yes
0.2            2                  1                  Yes
0.2            3                  1                  No
0.2            4                  1                  No
0.2            5                  1                  No
0.2            1                  2                  Yes
0.2            2                  2                  Yes
0.2            3                  2                  Yes
0.2            4                  2                  Yes
0.2            5                  2                  Yes

I noticed that I can't just calculate the volume of creeper emitted per second (intensity/interval) as the same volume per sec doesn't always give the same result. This clearly has to do with the damage per shot, fire rate, etc., but I don't have enough knowledge about the mechanics to determine this exactly. I read here that it should take 5 blasters to cap an emitter with 20 intensity, but what interval do they assume? Virgil, could you please shine a light on this?

Edit: To pose more direct questions:
1. Why is it impossible to cap an emitter with 1 intensity and 0.1 interval (10 creeper cells per sec) by 1 blaster, but is it possible to cap an emitter with 2 intensity and 0.2 interval (also 10 creeper/sec) or even an emitter with 5 intensity and 0.1 interval (50 creeper/sec) by 2 blasters (25 creeper per sec per blaster)?
2. What time frame should I use to calculate if an emitter can be capped? Obviously not per second.
3. Should I take the possibility of the +15% fire rate upgrade into account, or is the damage per blaster shot the only thing that matters?

Many thanks in advance!

[Twi]

You should note, too, that how long it takes for packets to get from Odin City to the Blasters is also a factor. Right now, I'm using FOUR blasters, and they are barely capping an emitter with intensity 5 and interval 1 (I think) because they're all the way across the map from Odin City and I have no Speed. It's a pretty windy path, too.

[UpperKEES]

That would only be an issue when in starvation/deficit mode. I assume the blasters are fully charged; it's up to the player to build speed injectors when required.

During my tests this wasn't an issue, see attached test map.

Edit:
PS: Twi, in your situation you might wanna deactivate 2 of the 4 blasters. The few packets that arrive can be used more effectively by 2 blasters, as 4 of them will shoot simultaneously at the same creeper (that will be eliminated anyway), instead of spreading the shots over time.

[Twi]

It was when I started.

Also, it actually has an interval of 0.1. >_>

And there are only three blasters. And one runs out of ammo every few seconds.
Anyways..

[knucracker]

Try this map.  Capping an emitter of 0.1/1 with 1 baster is possible.... just barely.  This is because a blaster will damage a maximum of 1 depth of creeper over an 'area'.  The area is limited by distance and the total number of cells that get damaged.  A blaster also can't fire every frame.  So an emitter can emit on a different frame than the blaster can fire on.  When this happens the creeper can spread out a little bit, which makes it really difficult to contain with a single blaster.

[UpperKEES]

Thanks, just tried it.

This is because a blaster will damage a maximum of 1 depth of creeper over an 'area'.

So how does one blaster cap an emitter with intensity higher than 1 (but interval >0.1)? In the first frame after emitting you would expect the creeper to be piled up in one cell above the emitter with the height of the intensity, right? (And then quickly spread out in the following frames when not capped.) I assumed all creeper get emitted at once during the first frame after the interval.... Or do you apply different code when capping?

The area is limited by distance and the total number of cells that get damaged.

Is distance from blaster to emitter the reason the 0.1/1 emitter is being capped in your map and isn't in mine? (In that case the +20% range upgrade might have more effect on capping than the +15% fire rate upgrade.) Or do you mean the distance from the emitter to the surrounding cells? If so, then why do we get different results in our test maps?

A blaster also can't fire every frame.  So an emitter can emit on a different frame than the blaster can fire on.  When this happens the creeper can spread out a little bit, which makes it really difficult to contain with a single blaster.

Ah! So 2 blasters firing in the same frame will have a different effect than 2 blasters firing in alternate frames? Or will this never be the case?

In general: can you say anything about the maximum capping capacity of 1 or 2 blasters? (I added some less vague questions to my initial post at the moment you were typing your reply.)

Your help is kindly appreciated! :)

[Xylnalya]

As much as I understoof Virgil, the reason for a 0.1 interval emitter not to be capped by a blaster is that he'll emit the creeper every frame, while the blaster for instance shoots every two frames. So the creeper'd have one frame to spread before the blaster shoots again.
This way, the 0.2 interval would allow a single blaster to cap the emitter since shot frequency and creeper emitation match.

So how does one blaster cap an emitter with intensity higher than 1 (but interval >0.1)?

This is because a blaster will damage a maximum of 1 depth of creeper over an 'area'.
[...]
The area is limited by distance and the total number of cells that get damaged.

I assume the area is limited to a single cell, therefor the whole blaster damage spreading over said small area and effectivly damaging more then one 'depth' of creeper? I'm unsure how to take the 'area' you mentioned, Virgil.

As for the 15% frequency or range upgrade, I doubt it'd make that much of a difference. While a blaster closer to an emitter needs less time to realise there's creeper and less time for the shot to reach the area and therefor damage the creeper, an increased range wouldn't enhance the capping abilitys of a blaster in any way. The frequency is a different matter, but I doubt that 15% change a lot. At least not as much as you could regulate an emitter with 0.1 steps in strength or interval.

[UpperKEES]

I'm indeed still interested in some answers here. I did some more testing with strange results. The distance from blaster to emitter matters a lot. When I vary this distance from 2 to 6 blocks, only one of the blasters caps (with distance 4 I believe). When I apply the range upgrade only the blaster with distance 5 caps the emitter. I can upload this testmap when I get back home.

[ontheworld]

simple answer to the first question: blaster shoots more than 2.5 down, it takes him more time than 0.1 to shoot again.

I guess that blasters shoot away a dept of 5, so if the blasters shoot at another time they can shoot all away

[UpperKEES]

Yeah, Virgil already explained that one; blasters can't fire every frame. Blasters kill only a maximum of 1 elevation layer of creeper per shot by the way.

[ontheworld]

oh... then i don't understand my results