Why did they make CW 3 like CW 1 instead of CW 2?

[thore95]

It just seems like Knuckle Cracker got lazy when they made CW 3 like CW 1, instead of trying to outdo    CW 2 it seems like they just copied CW 1 and added a lot of features. Now I am not saying that they did not modify CW 3 from CW 1, I am just saying they took the easy way out and copied the base game play from CW 1. They could have outdid themselves by completely redoing the game play like when they went from CW 1 to CW 2. I am not looking for any speculation here, I want an actual answer from someone at Knuckle Cracker or someone who has got a response to a question like this. If someone posts a sarcastic or stupid comment do not expect me to give any type of response.

[planetfall]

You could say this, to an even greater degree, of every FPS ever created.

CW1 was the more widely liked gameplay style, but some of its features lagged behind cw2. There isn't really a way to "completely redo" anything without a. scrapping the concept of the creeper, or b. making it true 3D (which would probably be inaccessible to most users due to processor limitations, and also probably have an extremely terrifying UI.)

Also, it's "he," not "they." KC is a one-man team (Virgil).

[Asbestos]

Lots of people hated the side view of CW2.

[thore95]

You could say this, to an even greater degree, of every FPS ever created.

CW1 was the more widely liked gameplay style, but some of its features lagged behind cw2. There isn't really a way to "completely redo" anything without a. scrapping the concept of the creeper, or b. making it true 3D (which would probably be inaccessible to most users due to processor limitations, and also probably have an extremely terrifying UI.)

Also, it's "he," not "they." KC is a one-man team (Virgil).

Thank you for actually answering my question and just giving some sarcastic remark. I did not know that KC was a one-man team either. I was also wondering if you personally think that he will make a CW 4 and have it be more like CW 2? I personally enjoyed CW 2 much more than either CW 1 or CW 3.

[Karsten75]

Wow. You start off pretty badly to accuse Virgil of being "lazy". Not really a good way to introduce yourself.

What you should know is that Virgil firstly makes a game that he wants to play. There is no design committee or anything. Virgil starts with an idea and goes from there. I was lucky enough to be in on the very early development of CW2 and I got to see the very first prototypes of the CW3 game (was called CFUN).

There isn't an aspect of Laziness anywhere - think about it, there is really only two modes of play - top down or side view. And do me the courtesy of not saying 3D, since that isn't workable.

After CW1, Virgil wanted to explore the side view aspect and made CW2. He found that intrinsically it had some inhibitors along with the good points. In CW3 he wanted more - some of the concepts of CW1 that was not in CW2, as well as some of the concepts of CW2 that was not in CW1. He experimented more with complex camera angles and views, and added elements that was not in either of the previous games - the most notable is the CRPL language that allows map makers far more control over enemy units.

It took him 3 years to rewrite the game from scratch in a new environment (Unity3D and C# as opposed to the previous Adobe Flash/AIR and ActionScript). He gained flexibility and huge performance increases, allowing him to do the things he had to skip in both previous games.

Now I've answered someone with your attitude and pre-conceived notions of this community enough. I hope that your future participation here is not based on assumptions of laziness of the one guy that works harder than anyone I know, or pre-conceived notions of "sarcastic and stupid" comments from the members here.

As for the next game, I've seen a few early notions (even more early than the CFUN prototypes), but it is not for me to disclose any details of where and how Virgil is thinking. He shares with the community those ideas he want to share via his blog at irregular intervals.

[knucracker]

"...just copied CW 1 and added a lot of features"

Guilty.

A more complete lineage might look like this:
Chaturanga -> OXO -> CW1 -> CW2 -> CW3  (Not to scale)
Each is a "copy" of the earlier game with a lot of features added.

[MadMag]

You should be a shamed of yourself!

[thore95]

Wow. You start off pretty badly to accuse Virgil of being "lazy". Not really a good way to introduce yourself.

What you should know is that Virgil firstly makes a game that he wants to play. There is no design committee or anything. Virgil starts with an idea and goes from there. I was lucky enough to be in on the very early development of CW2 and I got to see the very first prototypes of the CW3 game (was called CFUN).

There isn't an aspect of Laziness anywhere - think about it, there is really only two modes of play - top down or side view. And do me the courtesy of not saying 3D, since that isn't workable.

After CW1, Virgil wanted to explore the side view aspect and made CW2. He found that intrinsically it had some inhibitors along with the good points. In CW3 he wanted more - some of the concepts of CW1 that was not in CW2, as well as some of the concepts of CW2 that was not in CW1. He experimented more with complex camera angles and views, and added elements that was not in either of the previous games - the most notable is the CRPL language that allows map makers far more control over enemy units.

It took him 3 years to rewrite the game from scratch in a new environment (Unity3D and C# as opposed to the previous Adobe Flash/AIR and ActionScript). He gained flexibility and huge performance increases, allowing him to do the things he had to skip in both previous games.

Now I've answered someone with your attitude and pre-conceived notions of this community enough. I hope that your future participation here is not based on assumptions of laziness of the one guy that works harder than anyone I know, or pre-conceived notions of "sarcastic and stupid" comments from the members here.

As for the next game, I've seen a few early notions (even more early than the CFUN prototypes), but it is not for me to disclose any details of where and how Virgil is thinking. He shares with the community those ideas he want to share via his blog at irregular intervals.

First of all I did not know that KC was a one man team when I posted my question and being only one person working on it I could see how it was necessary to use the base game play from another CW game. Now if it was like ten or twelve people working on it like I assumed I would stick with my original comment of lazy, but not since it is just one person working on it. Since it is just one person I was wrong to say that it was lazy.

Now on the second point, in EVERY SINGLE forum that I have read or posted on, there are at least a handful of people the feel the need to diminish or make fun of the question or comment that was posted and that part of my post was directed towards them. I certainly did not mean to offend people that come to these forums with honest and sincere posts. If I did offend one of honest people that read my original question then I apologize.

[thore95]

You should be a shamed of yourself!

of what part?

[MadMag]

At least all of them... Irony from the start..

[arandomhalo]

I'd like to point out that CW1 is unlike any other game, at least I've never seen anything like it.  So even if Virgil had simply copied that and added features or levels, I would have called that a great game and purchased it.  As it turns out, with CW3 the graphics are better, the interface is better, there are a lot of new units, and as Karsten pointed out the user is given the ability to change not only the board itself but the behavior of every game object.  It's an entirely new game.

Regarding this forum, if you're new here you'll be pleasantly surprised at the way we treat each other.  I've seen posts that would ignite a flame war anywhere else on the internet, but here they continue as polite conversation.  I'd like to once again thank whoever it is that keeps it that way.

[ratobaraj]

I've been a fan of the series since the first game; I really like CW2 as it is, and as a sequel, because it was very different from the original, but it wasn't completely different, it was still Creeper World. CW3 blends the original game that made it popular with a lot of the features from CW2, and adds on to it. Using older designs isn't a step back, unless it really was exactly the same as the first. Virgil did an amazing job with it, and I think it should be up on the same pedestal as Warcraft or Command and Conquer. I really don't see how an updated CW2 would be better, and making it more like a modern 3D RTS, assuming he had the budget, would have taken it far from what makes it a great series.

[Nephthys]

*APPLAUSE* to Karsten75.

[4xC]

CW2 was a step up from CW1, CW3 was a step up from CW2, not much (if anything at all) to complain about.

In general, it seems RTS games fare better with vertical 3rd person POV's instead of horizontal 3rd person POV's.

[Courtesy]

I actually personally thought CW2 was 10 steps backwards. I still enjoyed it but I considered it an inferior installment to the first.