Custom Map #344: Asteroid Assault. By: planetfall

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This topic is for discussion of map #344: Asteroid Assault


Author: planetfall
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[PF #12] The plot thickens. So does the creeper. #CRPL #CustomEnemy #NoSpores #Digitalis #Runners #Void #Islands #PFSeries

[Flabort]

I see >1 of some types of tech shrines! Yes!
Including Pteraformers... Yes!

[tornado]

This is why I want an app
I want to play this right now

[Katra]

Another one I'm going to have to toss in the unwinnable round file. The missiles gradually whittled down my defenses until the CN took a direct hit at 15 minutes.

[planetfall]

Another one I'm going to have to toss in the unwinnable round file. The missiles gradually whittled down my defenses until the CN took a direct hit at 15 minutes.

The point of this map is that you can't get a "perfect" defense until near the end. Though it does help IMMENSELY to build a beam station with 4 relays on the PZ from the AET.

I will probably have to make an easy mode of this one as well...

[Flabort]

Another one I'm going to have to toss in the unwinnable round file. The missiles gradually whittled down my defenses until the CN took a direct hit at 15 minutes.

The point of this map is that you can't get a "perfect" defense until near the end. Though it does help IMMENSELY to build a beam station with 4 relays on the PZ from the AET.

I will probably have to make an easy mode of this one as well...

!!!

Genius idea. Back to the game!

[tornado]

No don't make an easy mode
The hint you gave is sufficient for me at least

[Flabort]

The hint you gave is sufficient for me at least

Almost for me too, but I'm still stuck. There are just too many runners for me :p

[Lenori]

Woot!  Took me all week, but I've done it!!

Props for another outstanding map pf!

[burguertime]

Another one I'm going to have to toss in the unwinnable round file. The missiles gradually whittled down my defenses until the CN took a direct hit at 15 minutes.

The point of this map is that you can't get a "perfect" defense until near the end. Though it does help IMMENSELY to build a beam station with 4 relays on the PZ from the AET.

I will probably have to make an easy mode of this one as well...

I built a bertha in the PZ, and would not change. Didn't make beam stations, and would not make even the pteraformers.

Spoiler

Missiles escalating, its because the corrupted forge is not dying fast enough.

Also, make two or three bombers and flood your main island with AC, or make a elevation 1 buffer to collect the creeper from the void.

I think its easy enough to counter the whole map with this combo: freeze bot + PZ bertha + guppy -> nullifier.

1) Order the guppies to land next to the forge.

2)  Send the freeze bot after a while, so he gets there BEFORE the guppies.

3) fire the PZ bertha AFTER BOT BLOWS (so the shot lands right after freeze starts but before guppies land).

4) Nullify, abandon island, send bot to next one.

5) After the forges are killed, remove the four emitters creating the digitalis. Some shielded runners will remain invincible, but the rest will be easily nullified.

Once the forges are done for, do the same

[close]

[burguertime]

Also @PlanetFall: make some way to move the builder one sub-cell to the sides as well. sometimes he is a bitch to align.

[tornado]

The reason he has not is because
A:he's got a reason
And B:you try to write crpl that request 2.5 packets

Also still can't win

[Jamz]

Wow, that was tough. But I think if anything, it was perhaps a little more on the annoying and frustrating side than the challenging side. There are so many things I noticed in this map that really became a nuisance.


1) Firstly is the issue with beams constantly firing at shielded stuff when actually all you want them to do (especially towards the beginning) is fire at missiles/spores only. This means all their ammo gets used up firing at stuff you dont want them to fire at and then when missiles come, you're pretty much pooped. The alternative route is that you build loooaaads of beams so that you have enough to cover you against aerial assaults AND take down the shields but then that uses up a ton of your energy.

2) Then there were the tiny annoying asteroids most of which needed terping in order to actually place units on them. That was fine, not too bad.

3) Also, what's up with the shields? From what I understand, the flying drones provide enemy units with shields. That I understand. You then remove the shields with your beams, but a few seconds later, they're back again even before the flying drones are able to re-shield it. How is it that the units are able to re-shield themselves without it being provided by the flying drones. Am I missing something?

4) Main problem I found though, boy oh boy, those runners. Those darn overpowered runners. Really, they were such a nuisance to deal with (especially those ones on the asteroids towards the east of the map) and when you factor in the above 3 points I mentioned, then you realise that actually, the problem is exponentially greater.
Let's break down the key features of runners in this particular map:
a) They can... well... run. duh
b) They can stop your units from operating.
c) They release creeper on death.
d) They can also emit creeper, act as corrupted totems etc.
e) They can also be shielded
[/color]

So, in order to take them out, first we must remove their shields by way of beams and then snipe them to death. However, when you consider Point 1) to Point 3) I mentioned, this becomes a lot lot trickier.
Firstly, beams are constantly firing. If not at the runners then at other shielded things or missiles. Fine, let's just build more then. Oh but wait, only if we have the space to. On the tiny asteroids, I need space to accommodate for relays (or guppies) to provide packets, then I probably need space for creeper busting weapons (cannons, mortars, sprayers), then I need space for the beams to not only take out missiles but to also lower the shields on the runners, and finally I need Snipers, all of which there isn't enough space for so you're kinda screwed. Oh and let's not forget to mention that obviously they move, so sometimes they end up falling out of the range of beams/snipers. And based on Point 3) of mine, even when you remove the shield, they'll automatically be back on in a few seconds even if not healed by a flying drone.

All of these points made the runners a blimmin nightmare and hence I would say the map was 40% fun, 60% frustrating. I did find ways round the problems I faced with the techs and stuff but still, very annoying.

Please have a look at the shielding system or kindly give an explanation if it is working as intended.
And if possible, (may not be), try see if you can introduce a bit of a targeting system for beams and snipers (and any other unit in the future which may begin to serve for multiple purposes.)



Also, totally unrelated, but the plot does indeed thicken quite nicely. Looking forward to what happens next.

[planetfall]

1) Firstly is the issue with beams constantly firing at shielded stuff when actually all you want them to do (especially towards the beginning) is fire at missiles/spores only. This means all their ammo gets used up firing at stuff you dont want them to fire at and then when missiles come, you're pretty much pooped. The alternative route is that you build loooaaads of beams so that you have enough to cover you against aerial assaults AND take down the shields but then that uses up a ton of your energy.

The solution to this is A. fire the singularity weapon (it damages the shields, and additionally suppresses the shield completely - it reappears with no health instead of 50%); or B. ensure the beams are firing constantly. The shields only heal on frames when they aren't being damaged, so if you let the beam fill up and then spend all its ammo, it will do a lot more damage than firing in spurts like starved beams do normally. To do this you can either build more beams; disarm beams until they are full or there is a missile attack; or build a beam station on the PZ from the AET. Since beam stations use reduced amounts of energy, it is possible to keep the beam constantly firing if you use 3-4 relays. Or C, you can use a flame drone. It damages all beam-damageable units other than spores. This includes shields. Though slower than using a beam, it's also more energy efficient. Alternately, you can use it to soften up the drones, runners, and missiles so your snipers and beams have to do less work.

For future maps, there will be toggles for beams to target/ignore building shields, runner shields, and missiles. But these will have to apply to all beams (as well as flame drones) due to limitations of crpl.

3) Also, what's up with the shields? From what I understand, the flying drones provide enemy units with shields. That I understand. You then remove the shields with your beams, but a few seconds later, they're back again even before the flying drones are able to re-shield it. How is it that the units are able to re-shield themselves without it being provided by the flying drones. Am I missing something?

The drones install shield generators on units. Once the shield is disabled, the generator delays for a few seconds (in this map I think 5) to store energy and then brings back the shield with half health. The drones only re-target units with shields already to repair them or upgrade the max health of the shield. And there is a way to abuse this... which is a bug, but it's also an interesting dynamic.

c) They release creeper on death.

You are missing an "anti" in this sentence.

So, in order to take them out, first we must remove their shields by way of beams and then snipe them to death. However, when you consider Point 1) to Point 3) I mentioned, this becomes a lot lot trickier.

False. The runners that spawn with shields need to be beamed if you want to kill them with PC's or snipers. However the runners with totems, which are shielded by the drones, only block 75% of incoming damage when the shield is at full health. And that amount reduces the lower the shield's health is.

Same goes for runner shields as unit shields.

I'm also pretty sure a bertha hit will instakill the spawned-shielded runners, since they have less health and the killing blow to runners ignores shield damage (again, limitations of crpl.)

Firstly, beams are constantly firing. If not at the runners then at other shielded things or missiles. Fine, let's just build more then. Oh but wait, only if we have the space to.

Pteroformers. And I didn't need one to beat it the second time when I cut ten minutes off my time. Upgrading fire rate also improves DPS of beams without increasing their ammo consumption per frame.

On the tiny asteroids, I need space to accommodate for relays (or guppies) to provide packets, then I probably need space for creeper busting weapons (cannons, mortars, sprayers), then I need space for the beams to not only take out missiles but to also lower the shields on the runners, and finally I need Snipers, all of which there isn't enough space for so you're kinda screwed. Oh and let's not forget to mention that obviously they move, so sometimes they end up falling out of the range of beams/snipers. And based on Point 3) of mine, even when you remove the shield, they'll automatically be back on in a few seconds even if not healed by a flying drone.

Are you using the AoO drones at all? Launch a conversion drone at one of the smaller islands, send in a sprayer and relay to keep the emitter under control, upgrade build speed, and nullity it. Easy enough.

All of these points made the runners a blimmin nightmare and hence I would say the map was 40% fun, 60% frustrating. I did find ways round the problems I faced with the techs and stuff but still, very annoying.

That was the point of them. For there to be a reason to use the flame drone, pteroformer, and to claim totems fast enough to get lots of weapon upgrades.

And if possible, (may not be), try see if you can introduce a bit of a targeting system for beams and snipers (and any other unit in the future which may begin to serve for multiple purposes.)

Only other unit that can do that is Thor, and I'm NEVER including Thor.
I will include beam target control in the next map. Sniper too in the next map with the drones.
Needless to say I can't disable firing at spores and runners, unless I create crpl spores and runners. And that's a can of worms.

Also, totally unrelated, but the plot does indeed thicken quite nicely. Looking forward to what happens next.

Glad you liked at least part of it :)

[Flabort]

I didn't see the text that said you would do this next map

You could create a script for the shields that turns off the shield's TARGETABLE_BY_BEAM when a button on the HUD by the shield is clicked; the button can turn it on again, too. And another button in the corner for automatically turning off targeting of new shields; which can be manually reactivated.
This would not make it so another form of damage is required, just make it easier to manage our beam use.

[close]

Also, I did not know that the Singularity weapon damages shields. I'm interested in how you made it do that in CRPL.