Custom Map #1092: Fortress PAC. By: WithersChat

AutoPost · March 20, 2021, 11:05:02 AM

This topic is for discussion of map #1092: Fortress PAC

Author: WithersChat
Size: 221x221

Binnes · March 20, 2021, 01:07:15 PM

Love these maps! Very fun

SteveCarlo · March 20, 2021, 02:15:49 PM

i couldn't seem to be able to get the lure to work

Jican · March 20, 2021, 06:38:43 PM

Why do you feel the need to make such bad changes to a great game? First was the need to give the enemy AI, which means they move when their units die and makes it virtually impossible to play the game without gimping it. Then you change the mesh for the worst. Nothing seems to make it work the correct way and frankly, the best game was the first game. I really hope you play the game without cheats when you playtest the maps so you see how some of the changes are NOT for the better.

Durikkan · March 20, 2021, 09:43:38 PM

Quote from: Jican on March 20, 2021, 06:38:43 PM
Why do you feel the need to make such bad changes to a great game? First was the need to give the enemy AI, which means they move when their units die and makes it virtually impossible to play the game without gimping it. Then you change the mesh for the worst. Nothing seems to make it work the correct way and frankly, the best game was the first game. I really hope you play the game without cheats when you playtest the maps so you see how some of the changes are NOT for the better.

The one with AI was not by WithersChat, but by another map author, qople. The mesh now is now more like it was in CW3 pac, where it's a lot easier to lay down, at the expense of subtracting 1 creeper from a tile where it's created. Honestly I think this system is a lot better because it's much easier to get larger amounts of mesh. The only side effect is you have to be slightly more active about laying it down, but it also avoids lag and allows you to place it under enemy buildings, etc. Unlike cw3 however, the mesh isn't always something you want to cover the entire map with, but this update made it a lot more usable in my opinion.

Also, any map has to be played without cheats to upload, that's the way the game works.

Jican · March 20, 2021, 10:15:02 PM

Quote from: Durikkan on March 20, 2021, 09:43:38 PM
The one with AI was not by WithersChat, but by another map author, qople.

Ah, I see. That makes sense. While I disagree with the mesh comment, it is nice to know that multiple people are attempting to make the PAC maps. I hope to see some positive changes to the type of map soon.

Shatterstep · March 20, 2021, 11:10:56 PM

I prefer this map's method for laying down mesh.

Shatterstep · March 20, 2021, 11:16:22 PM

While the map is interesting, it felt really slow. Admittedly, the first time I played I didn't notice the AC Breeder in one area of the map.

Flipping on the editor I had a blast adding in blobs, traditional spore launchers (with eggs!), and air sacs. Even with such, unless I went really overboard it took a long time to win. I'm willing to admit the possibility that I suck at PAC, lol.

I appreciate the work put into the map. I'm looking forward to more.

UberWaffe · March 21, 2021, 01:33:41 AM

Once I properly read the ADA message and saw you could adjust the mesh place size, I am much fonder of this method than the previous one.

SteveCarlo · March 21, 2021, 08:27:54 AM

that was fun.

WithersChat · March 21, 2021, 08:49:16 AM

Quote from: Jican on March 20, 2021, 06:38:43 PM
Why do you feel the need to make such bad changes to a great game?

"Such bad changes" doesn't seem to be the most popular opinion

Quote
First was the need to give the enemy AI, which means they move when their units die and makes it virtually impossible to play the game without gimping it.

1) The AI was given by someone else (Qople) on another map. I won't use it.
2) Some people find the AI more enjoyable to battle against than the default mode. It is indeed harder, but it makes you feel like you're actually fighting something, and not just come to destroy.

Quote
Then you change the mesh for the worst.

Ok, now you lost me. I mean, using mesh is SOOO much easier now, what's the problem?

Quote
Nothing seems to make it work the correct way and frankly, the best game was the first game.

An insane amount of people complained about the first map, because of mesh placement and lag. I just listened to feedback.

Quote
I really hope you play the game without cheats when you playtest the maps so you see how some of the changes are NOT for the better.

I do NOT use cheats. 2 reasons for that:
1) Only way to use cheats to upload a map would be to add external plugins, and I don't want it, neither I know how to do it.
2) That would break the whole idea, right? I played the whole map once, and I tried starting in all four corners to be sure it's possible (Stopped at the first factory destropyed).

Karsten75 · March 21, 2021, 09:21:40 AM

Quote from: Jican on March 20, 2021, 10:15:02 PM
Quote from: Durikkan on March 20, 2021, 09:43:38 PM
The one with AI was not by WithersChat, but by another map author, qople.

Ah, I see. That makes sense. While I disagree with the mesh comment, it is nice to know that multiple people are attempting to make the PAC maps. I hope to see some positive changes to the type of map soon.

I believe you owe the map maker an apology. Furthermore, your initial assertions that stated

Quote
I really hope you play the game without cheats when you playtest the maps so you see how some of the changes are NOT for the better.

Is un unwarranted attack on his integrity for which you have no proof. If you persist in accusing people here of using cheats, and you do not have proof to back you up, you will be removed from these boards.

Karzon · March 21, 2021, 03:07:59 PM

My issues with this new mesh: Emitters don't have mesh made under them, but if you click an emitter while drawing mesh it selects the the emitter instead (which is annoying). Workaround: Start making mesh somewhere else, and drag it TOWARDS the center of the emitter.

Before you could just drag to create a straight line, but now sometimes it ends up broken in the middle because the creeper wasn't deep enough or the screen scrolled too fast, and near the edges you have to keep clicking/waiting for it to be deep enough.

When I attacked the upper right, emitters over breeder terrain didn't seem to be able to connect mesh at all (though I'm not sure that's specific to this change as I don't remember breeder in the previous levels).

Edit: Whoops, copy and paste. Anyway, the level itself is a lot of fun, and you have to be aggressive enough to get some erns before the anticreeper takes over.

WithersChat · March 23, 2021, 04:35:21 AM

Quote from: Karzon on March 21, 2021, 03:07:59 PM
My issues with this new mesh: Emitters don't have mesh made under them, but if you click an emitter while drawing mesh it selects the the emitter instead (which is annoying). Workaround: Start making mesh somewhere else, and drag it TOWARDS the center of the emitter.

Yeah, I could make evrything unselectable during mesh placement maybe?

Quote
When I attacked the upper right, emitters over breeder terrain didn't seem to be able to connect mesh at all (though I'm not sure that's specific to this change as I don't remember breeder in the previous levels).

Breeder prevents mesh from being placed, so... (Note that the center of the emitter is where mesh grows)

Ranger Von Danger · March 23, 2021, 09:59:59 AM

Im sorry but I hated it. too many op units and lack of tools to defeat them. The Lure is meant to keep the enemy from firing on creeper, yet it doesnt function unless its submerged in creeper? uhh okay lol. I like the concept, and had a lot more fun playing the map where there were actually some special weapons to use.