Custom Map #3953: map 162 BIG BICKFORD PUZZLE. By: yum234

[RrR]

For me very interesting opinion of RrR, Ratboy, Rogacz and gambit. Are You used long distance spore attack? Or not?
If possible, please, comment.

Similar strategy to ratboy.

Spoiler

Focus on taking out the pz beams in the centre of the map before switching to a spore heavy game. So many totems, even relatively weak emitters spill into the void. Haven't managed to take the berthas out before they build yet (one spore cycle too late). If I synchronised my spores, I think I could knock several minutes off my current time.

[close]

[yum-forum]

What is difficult or wrong? Screenshots was not helpful?

It seems that forum read only few players.
Do not found right way for progress, came evil Berthas, do not read hint, no chance to win, exit, low rating, not happy. I too...

[Ratboy]

What is difficult or wrong? Screenshots was not helpful?

It seems that forum read only few players.
Do not found right way for progress, came evil Berthas, do not read hint, exit, low rating, not happy...

I tried again with the way you suggested and I was able finish even faster. It's a well made map with a real nice challenge and with multiple strategies for destroying those pesky Bertha. Try to ignore the rage-quit bad ratings.

[stdout]

10/10 and favorited. Currently this is my favorite PAC map from you Yum.

[yum-forum]

10/10 and favorited. Currently this is my favorite PAC map from you Yum.

Thank You!  :-[  :)

What do You think why so many unsuccessful tries even despite of the my full hint with screenshots?

[stdout]

I think most players are casual and don't visit the forums.

[yum-forum]

I think most players are casual and don't visit the forums.

I can suppose reason of low rating for this map.
TOO COMPLEX FOR ONE MAP MIXTURE OF:

BIG, MULTIPLE STRATEGIES, HARD, PUZZLE, BICKFORD, TRICKY, EVIL BERTHAS, PAC TYPE, NOT EASY START etc.  :)

[stdout]

Yes, I agree. But don't let that stop you.  ;D

[Stickman]

What do You think why so many unsuccessful tries even despite of the my full hint with screenshots?

Hello, Yum. Your PAC maps are great, don't let low map score prevent you from making more challenging maps. My time was about two hours after four-five restarts and quick forum check. I did not realize that you actually can drop spores right on EVIL BERTHAS, so my time is unimpressive. It was enjoyable, even with Berthas, and I absolutely hate them in PAC maps.

Your maps are great, did I metion it?

I had no problem with this map after I managed to properly secure bottom-left PZ and build spore tower here. A lot of PAC maps have tight starts, where you have to do everything just right or you cannot win, but these starts are short and you don't waste a lot of time (2-3 minutes?) if you make mistakes. After these intense moments you enter "stable" part of the map where you can lose time or progress, but you cannot lose a map. (Well, you can, if you wish, but you cannot be forced into situation where you cannot progress further)

But on this map this first "unstable" part is ten minutes long, so if you fail to secure bottom-left PZ in time and berthas get build, you cannot do anything and have to restart. Ten minutes do not sound big, but it's huge compared to normal PAC restart times. Also, it's balanced too perfectly for me - I could secure bottom-left PZ literally seconds before first bertha shot and I don't think I can do better. (I think I've beaten all of your other PAC maps - so I'm a least competent  :D)
Soooo:
1) You must figure out what to do, and you have an interesting bickford generator right near you starting point, which you must fully ignore, or you'll lose, because you'll run out of time. And bottom emitter at first does not look like it has enough power to overcome all firepower that gets thrown at it.
2) You cannot make mistakes. If you misfire a spore and it gets shot by a beam, you have to wait 20 seconds for another one, and that delay might be enough to let berthas ruin your day.
3) You don't make a lot of progress and gameplay is slow. A lot of time you just wait for the spore to reload or for bottom emitter to slowly eat away health of a canon. It does not feel very exciting. It does not help that you enemy is unimpressive - few common, not PZ-boosted units. You are just weak at this point, so bottom emitter confrontation does not feel like epic struggle, more like two babies trying to have a fight.

Ten minutes of rather slow and unexciting gameplay, you can't make mistakes, and you'll probably have to restart these ten minutes two or three times to figure out what you must and must not grab on the way down - that can spook casuals  ;) and it definitely spooked me. So my problem was not outsmarting swarm of berthas, it was getting to the point when I have enough resources to have a chance.

Your maps are amazing, by the way, this one was the reason I decided to submit my score and register on forum.

BTW, do you have plans on cutting bertha's health of further maps? It sometimes sucks to wait for bertha literally swimming in creeper to finally die, while if pulls energy out of thin air and keeps firing.

[jaworeq]

This is gonna be sooooo offtopic.

Yum, why aren't you creating maps for Particle Fleet? Your maps here were awesome and I'd love to see you in PF as well!

[yum-forum]

What do You think why so many unsuccessful tries even despite of the my full hint with screenshots?

Hello, Yum. Your PAC maps are great, don't let low map score prevent you from making more challenging maps. My time was about two hours after four-five restarts and quick forum check. I did not realize that you actually can drop spores right on EVIL BERTHAS, so my time is unimpressive. It was enjoyable, even with Berthas, and I absolutely hate them in PAC maps.

Your maps are great, did I metion it?

I had no problem with this map after I managed to properly secure bottom-left PZ and build spore tower here. A lot of PAC maps have tight starts, where you have to do everything just right or you cannot win, but these starts are short and you don't waste a lot of time (2-3 minutes?) if you make mistakes. After these intense moments you enter "stable" part of the map where you can lose time or progress, but you cannot lose a map. (Well, you can, if you wish, but you cannot be forced into situation where you cannot progress further)

But on this map this first "unstable" part is ten minutes long, so if you fail to secure bottom-left PZ in time and berthas get build, you cannot do anything and have to restart. Ten minutes do not sound big, but it's huge compared to normal PAC restart times. Also, it's balanced too perfectly for me - I could secure bottom-left PZ literally seconds before first bertha shot and I don't think I can do better. (I think I've beaten all of your other PAC maps - so I'm a least competent  :D)
Soooo:
1) You must figure out what to do, and you have an interesting bickford generator right near you starting point, which you must fully ignore, or you'll lose, because you'll run out of time. And bottom emitter at first does not look like it has enough power to overcome all firepower that gets thrown at it.
2) You cannot make mistakes. If you misfire a spore and it gets shot by a beam, you have to wait 20 seconds for another one, and that delay might be enough to let berthas ruin your day.
3) You don't make a lot of progress and gameplay is slow. A lot of time you just wait for the spore to reload or for bottom emitter to slowly eat away health of a canon. It does not feel very exciting. It does not help that you enemy is unimpressive - few common, not PZ-boosted units. You are just weak at this point, so bottom emitter confrontation does not feel like epic struggle, more like two babies trying to have a fight.

Ten minutes of rather slow and unexciting gameplay, you can't make mistakes, and you'll probably have to restart these ten minutes two or three times to figure out what you must and must not grab on the way down - that can spook casuals  ;) and it definitely spooked me. So my problem was not outsmarting swarm of berthas, it was getting to the point when I have enough resources to have a chance.

Your maps are amazing, by the way, this one was the reason I decided to submit my score and register on forum.

BTW, do you have plans on cutting bertha's health of further maps? It sometimes sucks to wait for bertha literally swimming in creeper to finally die, while if pulls energy out of thin air and keeps firing.

Very big thanks to You for so detail comments! And additional and special thanks that to write post You registrated in our Forum. For me it is very valuable!

Now about content of Your comments about this map:

1. Your scientifically detailed analysis of map is almost perfect.
2. Yes. You must fully ignore Bickford generator right near starting point (to save time!).
3. Yes.  To reach in time bottom-left PZ and start shooting (long distance spore attack) to not yet activated Berthas is critical for this map. Time is important and You cannot make mistakes. This is maybe very uncomfortable, but after disabling 4 auto-target Berthas game became doable and not too hard.
4. In my semi-hint and then in full hint (with screenshots) I explained about this. But unfortunately not so many players read our Forum.

P.S. I tried to create unusual&interesting PAC map with many new ideas and tricks... Sorry, please!  :)

[yum-forum]

This is gonna be sooooo offtopic.

Yum, why aren't you creating maps for Particle Fleet? Your maps here were awesome and I'd love to see you in PF as well!

As I know release of "Particle Fleet" will be in Sept., 30. I am waiting for this great event!  :)
I will buy it and maybe in future try to create some PF-maps...

[yum-forum]

What do You think why so many unsuccessful tries even despite of the my full hint with screenshots?

.......
BTW, do you have plans on cutting bertha's health of further maps? It sometimes sucks to wait for bertha literally swimming in creeper to finally die, while if pulls energy out of thin air and keeps firing.

I plan to create one more PAC map similar to this map 162. It will be not so hard, but again with auto-target Berthas. Important that if You already have good infrastructure even auto-target Berthas not so dangerous!  :)

[Stickman]

P.S. I tried to create unusual&interesting PAC map with many new ideas and tricks... Sorry, please!  :)

You're doing a great job! I enjoy your maps. They are hard, though, so they are not for everyone, but that's okay.

[Ratboy]

Bored at work today so I tried something. The map can be done using just emitters, except for the spore you start with, while leaving the berthas until just before the end. You just need to have large emitters away from where you are advancing. Focused on moving along the top to take out the top 2 commands while having some creep to the bottom to sometime distract the berthas. In the process of going for the bottom command the 4 berthas did start to take damage but the command was destroyed before them. After that the bottom left was easily flooded. Took about an hour.