Custom Map #2183: Annoying Gems

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This topic is for discussion of map #2183: Annoying Gems


Author: wishfind

Desc:
A lot of help...or is it?

[Khotekki]

That was incredibly un-fun.  In fact, I only beat it because I figured if I was going down vote it and comment on how un-fun it was, I should at least legitimize my opinion by slogging my way through.

As far as I can tell, the start was in some weird way random.  I must have restarted 20+ times, only to find that the set-up that I used to defend was the same one that I tried the first ten times or so.  I'm still not sure why it worked the final time, I can only assume it's some timing between the phantoms and the shots fired (I moved them around a tad, so I'm guessing that played a part).

Once I had it defended, I had to open up all the way down to the bottom, just to get the techs that took 500 energy to fill.  Even with a portal, that meant I had time to go make food while I waited for it to fill up.  After that, I spent a load of time having to open up the rest of the map to get to the bottom.  Then build up power to grab the crystals (which I was kind of doing as I opened up the map for tech).  It wouldn't have been bad except that each crystal took a horrible amount of energy to open up.  At the end I had like 220 power generation and at points, when I wasn't careful, had 280 power drain (actually, that was kind of cool, never had power numbers that high).

In the end, the game was slow, and semi-random to start off.  We're given tech (dark beam, and I'd argue the AC) that we can't even use.  High cost gems, and a map that's tall just to be tall.   I always appreciate people who take the time to make maps, even this one, but why you'd spend that much time making a map designed not to be fun and enjoyable is beyond me. 

Annoying isn't fun, it's annoying.  There's a couple ideas in this map that could have been fun, but for some reasons you decided to destroy those ideas by actively removing any purpose to them.   I hope you continue to make maps, but I hope you decide to make something worth playing.  You obviously have some good ideas, but play to those strengths in you map building, and don't cover them up by making things hard simply 'because'.

[wishfind]

This is not the slog you see it to be.  It seems you were distracted by every "red herring" on the map.  This is not meant to be a "build and research" map and I think several of the scores indicate people have figured that out.

[Khotekki]

No, I understand that it's not meant to be a build and research map, I simply did that because I wanted all the gems.  I was at the bottom of the map at about 15 minutes.  I don't know if that's a good time or a bad time for what you're aiming for, but at that point, the map was completely under control, so I started building and trying to knock out gems as fast as I could (I like getting gems, I can't help it).  Yes I could have finished it, but my score would have been incredibly poor (it looks like one person at least opted to go that route and has a great time, but a poor score).

I'll never claim that I'm very good at this game, but I can beat most maps and I usually have scores in the top third.  Looking at the other times on the map, it looks like a lot of people approached it similar to myself.  Most of the scores and times are relatively close to mine.

As far as it being a slog, I feel that way about it because whether I kept the amount of blasters you gave us, built more, re-arranged, I couldn't find a spacing that would allow me to advance up the map until I grabbed more tech.  Which involved a crawl down the map and a huge wait time.  Maybe I could have approached it differently, and gotten the tech from gems (really, one blaster rate or range upgrade is probably all you really need for this map), maybe that's the way I should have gone, but I still would have sat around waiting for the gems.  If there was another way, then I can't see it, but I'm willing to admit I can't see it.

At any rate, I still stand by the fact that I found it incredibly un-fun.  Mostly because of the start of the map. I'm all for maps that force me to barely hang on at the start, but this one forced me to restart so many times that it simply became frustrating.  If that's your goal, then ok.  But for me that robbed me of a lot of enjoyment.  

Please don't think I'm trying to be all negative, but I get irritated when people thumbs down and don't say why.  So, if I'm going to thumb down a map, I think I should at least tell the maker why I didn't enjoy it, and they can do what they want with it.  Also, don't think that I don't appreciate the time you put into making the map.  With a game like this, user created content is so important, and I've tried making maps and all of them have been absolutely horrible, so even though I didn't personally enjoy the map, I appreciate the fact that you created it and posted it for people to play.  

[wishfind]

It is possible to get to the bottom without any tech but there are enough easy tech along the way to increase your range or firing speed. 

For me it was about upsetting the value of gems that everyone is used to.  In this one you have to decide if the gem is worth it.  I haven't really seen anyone play with the cost/benefit of gems yet.

I maybe should have adjusted the gem point value but as it is, there is a choice to make about how to max points between gems and time.

[Zaggy]

Thumbs-up from me.

There's something about this map that I like; I can't quite figure it out.  But there's a satisfying trick that lets you work your way down faster than was probably intended.

Maybe it's my 'clean it up' attitude (not OCD; I just like things to be neat and tidy), and to get the highest scores, it demands that you clean up the trash (the gems themselves).  I think the values of gems were OK (the points, energy, and technites).  One consequence of having a point value for the gems is that it forces you to get all the gems.  If that was intended, that's fine.  The high score list is ordered by Points and not time, so it's pushing players into the 'maximize points' direction.

The 'gems getting in the way' concept is similar to a few older custom maps (one was 'RedLIght "speedtrap"', map #630).

I was excited when I saw the dark beam at the bottom.  I figured I'd just put it at the bottom and destroy the phantoms drones as they came out, and I wouldn't have to worry about them anymore.  But oops, experimentals weren't enabled on this map.  For me, that's the only downside of this map.

Keep up the good work, wishfind.  :)

[wishfind]

The no experimentals was an accident during testing but it annoyed me so much I had to leave it in.

[viper00900]

  When do the phantoms come out?  All I saw were drones. 
  Having the DB tech wasn't an issue for me, no room to use it properly anyway.  What really annoyed me was the gem costs.
However I only had to reset twice to figure out my defense, power balance and all that.  I also flooded the areas with AC to make it easier on my blasters, when my tech reached a decent level I shut the AC off and owned the map.  My time is so long because I love collecting gems  ;D.

[Bongo]

I was able to get ALL the gems in 12:35

I liked the map. It was an interesting exercise in timing and optimization.

Spoiler

Build as many Reactors as possible.
Collect Red Gems.
Beacon Upgrade.
Move down as much as possible + build Reactors.
Collect Green Gems.
Beacon Upgrade.
Move to the very end of map + build Reactors.
Collect (most) Green Gems.
Reactor Efficiency Upgrade.
Collect ALL White Gems.
As the White Gems start to 'pop' collect the Blue and Green Gems while moving up on the Drone Gateway.

Note: Drones set their target when they are first made so Drones will ONLY target something that was finished building when they were born. To move up you can build Blasters off the Drone path OR make a Microrift and move Blasters in before the new Drones target them. You can make Beacons far ahead of your Blasters by preceding them with 3 to 6 Shields to take the (very rare) Drone that will target it before the Blasters are made/moved in place. Makers are worthless, build reactors instead. The last Microrift is a little tricky because the new Drones will target it quicker. You will probably lose 50% of your Blasters moving them into place and a few Reactors from Drones that get through.

[close]

[viper00900]

I was able to get ALL the gems in 12:35

Show off  :P