This topic is for discussion of map #1260: Autobuild FPS 5
(https://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld4/queryMaps.php?query=thumbnailid&id=1260)
Author: Auri
Size: 256x160
Brilliant.
Definitely keep the upgrade system.
I would love to see even more upgrades for the non-weapon upgrades, such as the auto-build and auto-ac auras.
Spoiler
The upgrade system is in my opinion much better than the "auto-improve from energy generation" system.
I would actually suggest that the energy instead get converted into player upgrade points.
It is much the same mechanic, just a bit more player freedom on how it is spent.
In fact, what might be an idea to try out is a structure that basically demands all base energy and converts it into upgrade points when it is turned on. "SetUnitPacketRequestRate(self 1)"
That way the player has to decide when to boost themselves at the cost of draining the base of energy.
Upgrade costs might have to be adjusted.
I would keep the InfoCache points rewards and points rewards over time.
Those work very well as is.
thoroughly enjoyed. fps maps has easily become my favourite mode. Keep up the good work!
Regarding the upgrade system, i`d agree with uberwaffe. Potentially a way where upgrade points are generated? similar to erns perhaps. I`d just caveat that hopefully it doesnt make it seem too 'slow' to progress.
That was really fun, I like the new upgrade system and the choice being given to the player in how they specialise.
I think that there were a few too many points available in the upgrades, all "extra" points from time went into weapon power, which made my cannon into a portable sweeper as i decimated over height 40 creep with 1 hit. It's possible to do this earlier by ingoing certain upgrades and focusing on one weapon's upgrade and weapon power. This may be intentional, it didn't make it any less enjoyable for me.
The pace has picked up with this map, i normally play on 2x speed but had to stay at 1x because the character was moving faster than normal(i think, it felt faster, and the fire rate was pretty fast)
You keep making new things, and they're great(IMO), I can only keep looking forward to your next map. :D
Works well, and are fun! :)
Really good map, love the upgrade system. Although it seemed like the autosprayer and ERN upgrade didn't actually do anything. Or their effects were so minimal that they may as well not have been there.
(This is Auri, by the way)
Quote from: UberWaffe on April 06, 2021, 03:52:47 PM
Brilliant.
Definitely keep the upgrade system.
I would love to see even more upgrades for the non-weapon upgrades, such as the auto-build and auto-ac auras.
Spoiler
The upgrade system is in my opinion much better than the "auto-improve from energy generation" system.
I would actually suggest that the energy instead get converted into player upgrade points.
It is much the same mechanic, just a bit more player freedom on how it is spent.
In fact, what might be an idea to try out is a structure that basically demands all base energy and converts it into upgrade points when it is turned on. "SetUnitPacketRequestRate(self 1)"
That way the player has to decide when to boost themselves at the cost of draining the base of energy.
Upgrade costs might have to be adjusted.
I would keep the InfoCache points rewards and points rewards over time.
Those work very well as is.
Yeah, I'll probably flesh those out those non-weapons a bit more in future maps (and every map will probably have a couple upgrades that you can only find in the field). I wanted to keep it a bit simpler in the first map to gauge opinions and let people get used to the system. The hotkeys to spend came near the end, and I think that's a big help in making it less of a hassle to use.
Well, the thing with removing all automatic stuff for weapons is, I wanted to keep the weapons roughly on par with each other. Otherwise people would be tempted to spend all of their points in a single weapon, and be tempted to use that everywhere, or make things really hard for themselves. I could have weapon power and firing rate upgrades, but I wasn't sure if that would be too tedious to repeatedly spend points in.
Quote from: dwilkinson on April 06, 2021, 04:50:18 PM
That was really fun, I like the new upgrade system and the choice being given to the player in how they specialise.
I think that there were a few too many points available in the upgrades, all "extra" points from time went into weapon power, which made my cannon into a portable sweeper as i decimated over height 40 creep with 1 hit. It's possible to do this earlier by ingoing certain upgrades and focusing on one weapon's upgrade and weapon power. This may be intentional, it didn't make it any less enjoyable for me.
The pace has picked up with this map, i normally play on 2x speed but had to stay at 1x because the character was moving faster than normal(i think, it felt faster, and the fire rate was pretty fast)
You keep making new things, and they're great(IMO), I can only keep looking forward to your next map. :D
I'll definitely add more things to spend points on in the future. It shouldn't have been possible to get a cannon that is quite that insane (unless that was quite a bit of an exaggeration). The weapon upgrades were supposed to be relatively low in power so that you'd spend on other things first most of the time, and then spend points on that once you ran out of interesting things to spend points on.
Quote from: Malignantmind on April 06, 2021, 05:08:38 PM
Really good map, love the upgrade system. Although it seemed like the autosprayer and ERN upgrade didn't actually do anything. Or their effects were so minimal that they may as well not have been there.
Autosprayer just constantly puts out AC, if you look down, you'd be able to see your tile filling up with creeper and spreading to other tiles. It did also scale a bit based on the power of your sprayer, so it got more powerful as the mission went on. It's deliberately not nearly as strong as the actual sprayer though, because I didn't want it to basically obsolete the sprayer. The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PM
(This is Auri, by the way)
I'll definitely add more things to spend points on in the future. It shouldn't have been possible to get a cannon that is quite that insane (unless that was quite a bit of an exaggeration). The weapon upgrades were supposed to be relatively low in power so that you'd spend on other things first most of the time, and then spend points on that once you ran out of interesting things to spend points on.
It is possible to do it if you intentionally use up all the points you get towards that, i assume the majority of players wouldn't want to do that. i managed it the second time round but my time was way worse than my first run as it took me longer to build things and i kept going back and forth in the same areas since i couldn't hold areas i wasn't facing properly, i almost considered giving up but through sheer bull-headedness i did it.
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PM
The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
Does it? I actually tried to play the map without using any weapon but the fabricator/its associated aura and that ERN upgrade. I did notice the fabricator aura gradually working...but for the life of me I can't tell a single difference from that ERN aura. I see a cannon shooting at creep; it stops as the creep gets out of range. I step up to the cannon...nothing. It doesn't get any more range. I see a mortar happily shooting away- step up to it...no increased fire rate. Just normal pelting. I see a sprayer with a hump of AC over it...walk up to it - the hump doesn't raise in size.
Maybe I'm missing something? Increased damage? I don't know; other auras work fine but the ERN one doesn't appear to.
To be fair; I was concerned it would be way too powerful. =]
Love the upgrade system. I hope it becomes a staple in your maps. The upgrades themselves seemed very overpowering very quickly though. I would like to see different types of upgrades as well. Otherwise, phenomenal map making.
Quote from: knightace on April 06, 2021, 06:40:12 PM
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PM
The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
Does it? I actually tried to play the map without using any weapon but the fabricator/its associated aura and that ERN upgrade. I did notice the fabricator aura gradually working...but for the life of me I can't tell a single difference from that ERN aura. I see a cannon shooting at creep; it stops as the creep gets out of range. I step up to the cannon...nothing. It doesn't get any more range. I see a mortar happily shooting away- step up to it...no increased fire rate. Just normal pelting. I see a sprayer with a hump of AC over it...walk up to it - the hump doesn't raise in size.
Maybe I'm missing something? Increased damage? I don't know; other auras work fine but the ERN one doesn't appear to.
To be fair; I was concerned it would be way too powerful. =]
It worked when I was testing it, but it's possible it has some issues. I'll take another look at it for the next map and make sure it's working right. Worth noting that it can take up to a second for it to take effect because it pulses less often because it takes more computation than a lot of the rest so I didn't want it update too often.
Quote from: Jican on April 06, 2021, 07:10:31 PM
Love the upgrade system. I hope it becomes a staple in your maps. The upgrades themselves seemed very overpowering very quickly though. I would like to see different types of upgrades as well. Otherwise, phenomenal map making.
Yeah, I was trying to avoid the map becoming too much of a slog, but I may have slightly overcompensated. After this positive reception the upgrade system will definitely return. I've got a number of other ideas for potential abilities and upgrades.
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PMAutosprayer just constantly puts out AC, if you look down, you'd be able to see your tile filling up with creeper and spreading to other tiles. It did also scale a bit based on the power of your sprayer, so it got more powerful as the mission went on. It's deliberately not nearly as strong as the actual sprayer though, because I didn't want it to basically obsolete the sprayer. The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
They were the first two upgrades I picked, and I didn't notice any AC, not even a trickle, spawning at my feet. And there was no noticeable difference when I moved near turrets with the ERN upgrade. Although. Maybe I'm just used to playing on 4x speed normally so when I play FPS maps everything seems slow. Either way. Great map, make more. :D
Quote from: Malignantmind on April 07, 2021, 12:33:44 AM
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PMAutosprayer just constantly puts out AC, if you look down, you'd be able to see your tile filling up with creeper and spreading to other tiles. It did also scale a bit based on the power of your sprayer, so it got more powerful as the mission went on. It's deliberately not nearly as strong as the actual sprayer though, because I didn't want it to basically obsolete the sprayer. The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
They were the first two upgrades I picked, and I didn't notice any AC, not even a trickle, spawning at my feet. And there was no noticeable difference when I moved near turrets with the ERN upgrade. Although. Maybe I'm just used to playing on 4x speed normally so when I play FPS maps everything seems slow. Either way. Great map, make more. :D
I felt like that needed more investigation so I did. Ah, it looks like there's a bug there. If you buy upgrades before unpausing the first time, they don't actually work. :-[ Will definitely get that fixed for the next map. Sorry about that.
Great map! Easily one of the best i've played.
The upgrade system is amazing, giving choice to the player. I'm happy to hear that you are planning to add more upgrades, I wonder if some more powerful/more costly upgrades would be good? Give the player the choice on whether to spend early or save up early for a 6 or even 8 pointer? Maybe an auto-firing mortar or something? Or maybe a 10-pointer could be a hotkeyed conversion weapon (with appropriate cooldown)
I did see an effect from the ERN/Anticreep upgrade, but it wasnt much until later, does it scale with weapons?
The only slight negative is it was very easy. Would have liked the later creeper bits to be tougher especially, by about halfway through you can be very overpowered. It takes about 10 mins to clear the first third and about the same for all the rest.
I did find a fun challenge though! No-fingers challenge: Can you kill all creeper without firing a single shot? (Auras only).
Try and get to 0 creeper 0 eggs, and if you fire anything, even fabricator, you must reload or restart. I managed 36 min.
i played it without reading about upgrade system, and it was still fun. i was wondering why infocache did not work so i read the description and then replayed using upgrade system :)
I got twice the fun out of it, great work man. I really liked the upgrade system.
I dig the upgrade system. Other's have pointed out the same things I would've, so not going to repeat their words here.
One thing that I'm pondering on, though; does the upgrade system make the game too easy? As was stated in an earlier reply, people just pumping everything they have into one weapon, and not using any others might be detrimental, but using a really suped up cannon and just parting the red sea like Moses is really fun! There's also might be a problem in balancing. Given the benefits of the upgrade system, the enemy would have to be pumped up as well, but if that is done poorly, the enemy might overrun an unwary player.
I was only a few minutes from the end when an egg popped right on me, and since I didn't have my hand on the movement keys at the time I was unable to get away in the couple of seconds it took for my health to drop below 75% and cost me the objective. I recognize this is user error - both in not being ready to move and not having a recent save, forcing me to either start over from the beginning or use editor mode to get it back - but the fact that there are eggs flying around but no snipers to deal with them is not.
Quote from: Durikkan on April 07, 2021, 01:40:02 AM
Quote from: Malignantmind on April 07, 2021, 12:33:44 AM
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PMAutosprayer just constantly puts out AC, if you look down, you'd be able to see your tile filling up with creeper and spreading to other tiles. It did also scale a bit based on the power of your sprayer, so it got more powerful as the mission went on. It's deliberately not nearly as strong as the actual sprayer though, because I didn't want it to basically obsolete the sprayer. The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
They were the first two upgrades I picked, and I didn't notice any AC, not even a trickle, spawning at my feet. And there was no noticeable difference when I moved near turrets with the ERN upgrade. Although. Maybe I'm just used to playing on 4x speed normally so when I play FPS maps everything seems slow. Either way. Great map, make more. :D
I felt like that needed more investigation so I did. Ah, it looks like there's a bug there. If you buy upgrades before unpausing the first time, they don't actually work. :-[ Will definitely get that fixed for the next map. Sorry about that.
Ah yeah, that'd explain it. Yay I found a bug! :D And no worries. I beat it either way and still enjoyed the map. :D
Quote from: Durikkan on April 07, 2021, 01:40:02 AM
Quote from: Malignantmind on April 07, 2021, 12:33:44 AM
Quote from: Durikkan on April 06, 2021, 05:27:36 PMAutosprayer just constantly puts out AC, if you look down, you'd be able to see your tile filling up with creeper and spreading to other tiles. It did also scale a bit based on the power of your sprayer, so it got more powerful as the mission went on. It's deliberately not nearly as strong as the actual sprayer though, because I didn't want it to basically obsolete the sprayer. The ERN upgrade does make any units within 10 tiles switch to their ERNed state while you're near them, but maybe that gets overshadowed a bit by the time you get strong weapons.
They were the first two upgrades I picked, and I didn't notice any AC, not even a trickle, spawning at my feet. And there was no noticeable difference when I moved near turrets with the ERN upgrade. Although. Maybe I'm just used to playing on 4x speed normally so when I play FPS maps everything seems slow. Either way. Great map, make more. :D
I felt like that needed more investigation so I did. Ah, it looks like there's a bug there. If you buy upgrades before unpausing the first time, they don't actually work. :-[ Will definitely get that fixed for the next map. Sorry about that.
...didn't even consider that. That is exactly what I did. Went back and tested; ERN works fine. Time to replay the map again! :D haha
At first, I didn't like the upgrade system. I was in love with the old system that felt like you're exploring and picking up new equipment. You'd have to choose if you want to dash towards certain equipment to use it earlier, and that choice was fun to me.
Now that I've played with the upgrade system more, though, it really adds replay value to the map! It's fun to do one-weapon runs with this system or pick and choose which equipment to use from the get-go. I wouldn't want every map to use this upgrade system from now on, but it's a great new tool in the FPS map maker's tool-kit! I'm sold!
As for feed-back: I'd like to see a way to increase the radius of all the auras we're given? And, as much as I'm shooting myself in the foot here, maybe limit the amount of upgrade points more. Really make players think about what we want. Heck, if you're looking for new mechanics to add altogether, maybe a class system choice at the very beginning? Gunner, demolitionist, engineer? I think that sounds fun :D
Custom 4 does nothing and when I pause I cannot see any upgrade panel. How do you use the upgrade points?
Quote from: D0m0nik on April 08, 2021, 01:26:27 PM
Custom 4 does nothing and when I pause I cannot see any upgrade panel. How do you use the upgrade points?
It should select the upgrader unit when you press that, and it works even when paused, so I'm not sure what the issue is for you. You do have custom4 bound to a key, right? It works the same way as the dps thing that's bound to custom3, so if that doesn't select that dps reporting unit either, I'm not sure what the issue would be. I'm assuming you're on the latest cw4 version.
This is what the panel looks like, and alternatively you could try manually selecting it (you can see where the selection box is in this screenshot, but you'd have to click precisely on it)
Cheers. Turns out I had to press custom 4 whilst paused, did not work in open play.
Love the upgrades. Thank you much for the map.
This rocks!
Love it.
I had a thing happen, not sure if it was a bug, or I did something wrong. It was early, just rounding the first corner, when all of a sudden the 1st person gun stopped working. It was still showing an animation of shooting, but instead of being white dots, it was green, and it had zero effect on the creeper. Fortunately I had saved, and was able to just go back a short while, but i never understood why that happened.
Love these maps!
Quote from: CyberDyneSystems on April 25, 2021, 07:08:50 PM
This rocks!
Love it.
I had a thing happen, not sure if it was a bug, or I did something wrong. It was early, just rounding the first corner, when all of a sudden the 1st person gun stopped working. It was still showing an animation of shooting, but instead of being white dots, it was green, and it had zero effect on the creeper. Fortunately I had saved, and was able to just go back a short while, but i never understood why that happened.
Love these maps!
That was the Fabricator "weapon", it can build/arm units and also restores health of units being damaged by creeper. you either pressed the number key for it(i believe it's 4, i don't think you get sniper on this one) or scrolled the mouse wheel to cycle weapons.
I did the same thing in the autobuild FPS 3 i think, i didn't realise i had swapped from cannon to sprayer and was gutted when it went mortar all of a sudden on some thinned out creep, i thought i couldn't choose which weapon i used, i also didn't realise the scroll wheel changed weapons.
Thanks, yes, that's exactly what it was. I've "discovered" these maps with Auri's most recent one, and have been going backwards. I played 3 (this being the 3rd) before I realized I could change weapons! (Don't ask!) My own fault for going backwards. I am learning in reverse order. :-*
Hello everyone. I have a problem playing FPS maps 4-8. And as i can see on the forums noone else seems to have it.
When game starts custom1 is not working to go on First person. This problem only happens on maps 4 to 8. Maps 1 - 3 works like a charm.
Also i noticed that the message informing us about custom1 button in center screen dont dissapear after game starts.
I have tried everything as you can imagine. From restarting client to remap keys to all possible combinations, nothing worked.
Custom 3 and 4 seems to work as they indeed open their coresponding menus about suit info and upgrades.
Any help would be deeply appreciated.
Are you updated to the latest game version? That would be 1.4.8 as viewed from the main menu, I believe. I forget which map I switched to the version of the fpscore that required version 1.4 or higher. That would be my first guess, but if you are up to date we can do some additional troubleshooting.