This topic is for discussion of map #1658: Zesi
(http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld3/queryMaps.php?query=thumbnailid&id=1658)
Author: Thumbmaster
Size: 175x200
Desc:
Our very first PAC map. Enjoy! #PAC #PlayAsCreeper
How do you get this one started?
Same question: How?
I think use the Shift + T while having the Terraform selected on the ground level 10 and use that tell the terps to block the sprayers and pulse cannons on level 9 terrain. If not then bug ;D
This map is currently rated at around 4/10 and the only explanation I can think of is that the start is impossible until you realize that you're supposed to corrupt the terp and take control, using it to your advantage.
I thought the map was great. Once you get a foothold there is a good pace throughout, well placed defenses, numerous paths to victory. Excellent map. Don't let the low ratings discourage you. I think a lot of people rage quit and rated it a 1 because of that. For my rating, you got a 9/10.
We gave you 3 terps. Use them wisely. 8)
We borrowed this strategy from one of the very popular PAC maps and felt it should be obvious.
Spoiler
Leave the NW island alone until you've overtaken the central island. Once you utilize the terps, you should be able to take the central island in less than 10 minutes.
Ratings don't concern us. Constructive comments do. Thanks, Stdout!
And thanks to Hubs for fixing our codes and everyone else who helped with play-testing.
I've attached the original design. I had to fight him tooth and nail to make even the tiniest alterations. But the terps were all
his idea.
I love that hand drawn map plan!! Very, very cool.
Yeah, awesome map plans! I like how he even drew the menu at the bottom with how much Aether the forge had haha.
Yeah I also got a good chuckle out of that. :)
Very excited to play your first PAC map and after half an hour of frustration came here and learnt about the terp thing! I did not know about this possibility and it was starting to drive me crazy!
Now that I know about it I still can't figure it out, I can terp but only at a level of 3, how do I change it/control it????
Also love the drawing!
Hang on, Richard333 explained it, I got it!
Eh, I just brute forced it. No terps needed for me :P
Took some tricky moves at the start to get my 4th power zone though, but once I did and got my spores going, it was a downhill from there.
Very well done to you and the boss, Thumbmaster! :) I had to restart a fair few times before I realised about the Terps! However, I still couldn't do it, so hopped over here and saw Richard's Shift+T post (thanks, Richard).
Great map, you tricksy pair. :D
Overall, I really enjoyed this map. The start is tough but this helps:
Spoiler
Once you can grow digitalis between the two left emitters (in the center island) change the upper emitter to a spore tower and start pounding away at the beam and shield above it.
Once I had the center island I converted all but one emitter to spores and took out the upper right island and the island above the base in the lower left. That cut power to the three islands in the upper left, which gives you plenty of PZs for spore towers.
I think by the end I had over 75 spores wipe out the last base ;D
Fun map once I figured out that some of the enemy units were secretly on my side and would obey keyboard terraforming commands.
Not sure how people are meant to guess that, or how people who don't know the keyboard shortcuts would be able to do it.
Quite good except for that- could be fixed with a couple lines of intro text.
it was in a previous PAC map, but perhaps a subtle clue in PAC maps that use it in future would be helpful :)
Great suggestions, guys! How can I fix the intro text without having a duplicate map on CS? I'm thinking maybe adding a #terp tag to the description from now on may help.
Quote from: thumbmaster on January 29, 2015, 07:49:56 AM
Great suggestions, guys! How can I fix the intro text without having a duplicate map on CS? I'm thinking maybe adding a #terp tag to the description from now on may help.
dunno if
you can, well V could do it, but it's not really worth the hassle, #terp should do it in future 8)
Very satisfying map once you figure out how to get first first island
This map was so difficult at first but using Hubbs' idea method to get started made it a lot easier.
still don't know how to start :'(
NW useless
central island have three ,
SE、Top、SW
SE looks like useless too
if want stop terp change map should use SW to start
but don't know how to go
Not much else to say other than the map was hair-pulingly frustrating at the start, to the point that I cannot get PAST the start. I don't know what you were thinking setting it up that way, but you've made it damn near impossible (and I only say that because others on here apparently have done it).
Northwest island is a bust. Central island is almost entirely locked down. Between the PZ Mortar, two PZ Strafers, Bombers and Bertha bombardment, you cannot expand or grow Digitalis anywhere useful. That Totem in the centre? Forget about holding it for more than 5 seconds, the Bertha's next shot will take care of that.
Tried Hubs' strategy of converting the topmost central Emitter to a Spore launcher, didn't get anywhere. You can beat the Beam and Shield and get some Digitalis PREPARED to grow to those locations....but the triple bombardment methods plus all the AC from the Bombers hammering your Emitters mean it will not get anywhere near expanding. You're also not getting that Spore tower back into an Emitter, because the Digitalis can't get to it.
The Terps are useless, I can't change their height and trying to alter the terrain, which is locked at level 3 unless I'm forgetting hotkeys for the height, does absolutely nothing to stop the Cannons and Mortars beating your Emitters into the ground.
All in all, that made me frustrated. Very frustrated. It felt like an exercise in masochism.
Then I came on here looking for advice, and found not only others saying that yeah they've done it, but also you saying "We borrowed this strategy from one of the very popular PAC maps and felt it should be obvious."
That just made me extremely angry, because it felt like mocking and I felt like even more of an idiot for not getting what I was supposed to do and apparently missing what so many others got and gushed over.
So the score's at 1 for all that.
Quote from: Hubs on January 28, 2015, 08:11:57 AMOverall, I really enjoyed this map. The start is tough but this helps:
Spoiler
Once you can grow digitalis between the two left emitters (in the center island) change the upper emitter to a spore tower and start pounding away at the beam and shield above it.
Once I had the center island I converted all but one emitter to spores and took out the upper right island and the island above the base in the lower left. That cut power to the three islands in the upper left, which gives you plenty of PZs for spore towers.
Tried that, didn't work for me.
The Beam and Shield do fall, so there's no problem there. The issue is getting Digitalis to the PZs to expand your Creep coverage.
Between the Mortar shelling your emitters, the Strafers severing any Digitalis that you try and grow between your Emitters, the Bombers dropping AC loads to slow down Digitalis growth and periodic Bertha shots wiping out any significant Creeper pool and Digitalis with it, I've gotten nowhere.
This explanation feels like it's missing about 2 or 3 steps to actually GETTING the Digitalis you need anywhere, because once you convert that Emitter to a Spore you CANNOT turn it back, the Strafers and Bombers make damn sure of that by cutting off and slowing down Digitalis growth so much it will never reach the topmost starting PZ before the Berthas fire again and destroy it all.
How EXACTLY did you do it? I'm aware of the Terps, but they've done absolutely nothing for me. Changing the ground height doesn't solve the Strafer, Bomber or Bertha problem.