This topic is for discussion of map #1587: THE DEVIOUS ARACHNID
(http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld3/queryMaps.php?query=thumbnailid&id=1587)
Author: Xeos
Size: 160x120
Desc:
This is a very hard PlayAsCreeper Map. I have designed it to be quite challenging but it might be too hard for some new players to PAC maps as you will need to use the full range of skills in playing PAC maps to beat this. So good luck and I hope you enjoy it :), but if you get stuck, make a post in the forum and I will help. All comments in the forum whether good or bad are very helpful and appreciated. Cheers Xeos #PAC #PlayAsCreeper
Nice one! :D
Quote from: mmh on January 09, 2015, 03:50:36 PM
Nice one! :D
Cheers - Did you find it challenging? did you get it right at the start first time?
Tricky without being tedious.
Quote from: Xeos on January 09, 2015, 03:55:28 PM
Quote from: mmh on January 09, 2015, 03:50:36 PM
Nice one! :D
Cheers - Did you find it challenging? did you get it right at the start first time?
It was challenging and fun. I had to try a couple of different approaches until i found a way. I might try again to get a better time.
I'm intrigued to know if you got the start sequence right or did you have to do a few restarts?
I am having real problems getting started with this one and normally I don't having a problem, must be missing something?
I got stuck... any ideas for the begining?
Change the emitter to store the creeper before releasing it. To do that, click on the emitter and then press the letter R. A red dot will appear and now the emitter will store up 400 creepers before releasing.
Quote from: stdout on January 09, 2015, 04:12:20 PM
Change the emitter to store the creeper before releasing it. To do that, click on the emitter and then press the letter R. A red dot will appear and now the emitter will store up 400 creepers before releasing.
Well, I have already tried it and I'm still stuck... I tried to overload that AC emitter right in the south, I thought it would change to a normal emitter, but ...
The start sequence can be done like this...
This is the start sequence explained....
Spoiler
Step 1: From the emitter, Drag a field straight up towards the PZ through the Totem- lay down lots of digitalis and when the wall goes lay down more digitalis to get the first pz with another emitter
Step 2: Support the first emitter and then get the Totem on the left - You will need to play with the field to get this.
Step 3: Switch the support to the second emitter and using the now more powerful field, take the cannons up through the middle
Hope that helps :)
Awesome map, Xeos. Here's how I did it:
Spoiler
Once I took the first PZ, I built a spore tower on it. Then the first spore took out the relay above the group of 4 cannons! That cut off all the units and they quickly ran out of ammo. It didn't take long for the entire south of the map to be cleared of units. Then I used the spore tower to build a digital network over to the runner nest. Once the runners were let out of the box, I turned the spore towers attention to the void between the east island and me, and the rest is history.
That is what's great about this game. There are endless ways to approach it. You even used the runners as I didn't expect.
But glad you enjoyed it :)
Cheers
Neat! I did it a third, different way!
Spoiler
Took the 2nd PZ, replaced my first emitter with a spore and cut off the relay, like stdout. Except from there, I used spores spores and fields to push over to the middle CC and took it out, then went after the right CC. Once I had those PZs, I turned them all into emitters and took over the original AC generating totem and runner nest. I tried the left CC with 100% emitters, with very near tantalizing success, but it just wasn't going. I switched to all-but-one spores, and that took it down pretty quickly.
I'm considering giving it another go to try and improve my time, now that I realized a better way to end it!
this map is a sweet puzzle- sweet enough to get me onto these forums. I do this thing that I don't know if it's a thing or not on PAC maps and was wondering if it's just me-
Spoiler
I start a digital track over open space with a spore, load it up to 10-15 depth, and smash the T button twice to delete the creeper, dump it into space, and then start re-forming it into more spread out digitalis
How I did it, however-
Spoiler
Set the first to burst, forced it to the second PZ where I planted a spore tower, at this point, I knocked out the first three cannons
Got the runner nest (for no reason) and the totem (for good reason) near the start
started a digital network leading from the second PZ
deleted spore tower and changed it to an emitter, made it take focus and started pushing the creeper from the emitter into the open space network, then did the open-space digital trick
Took the eight PZs and the one near it, adding spore towers
pointed all of the spore towers into the open space, very near the zig-zag and forced the creeper onto the land with the beam tower and then the cannons. once the reactors were destroyed, "found the sweet spot" and started shuffling pools of creeper around the open space just outside of the second beam tower range, made it to the point where I could destroy the northernmost cannon with a small puddle.
pointed the spores to the top left most corner and was able to shuffle it down until victory.
I ignored the runner farm, and the cannons in the middle to rock it out
Quote from: UrMawMah on January 09, 2015, 05:18:54 PM
this map is a sweet puzzle- sweet enough to get me onto these forums. I do this thing that I don't know if it's a thing or not on PAC maps and was wondering if it's just me-
Spoiler
I start a digital track over open space with a spore, load it up to 10-15 depth, and smash the T button twice to delete the creeper, dump it into space, and then start re-forming it into more spread out digitalis
That method is necessary to do the map but no one has done it quite like I wanted them too ha ha. The spores are so hard to predict how they are going to be used and where because whilst you can control their use to a point, there is always someone who finds another way :) Like you ! ha ha
Glad you enjoyed it though. I t makes the hours and hours it takes to make it and test it worthwhile .. 8)
Xeos, it's a compliment when people find multiple ways to win a map. In fact, to me the most important aspect of a map is that it should offer numerous ways to win.
This map gets a rare 10/10 from me and it's one of my favorite PAC maps yet. I eagerly anticipate the next challenge you throw at us.
Quote from: stdout on January 09, 2015, 05:48:36 PM
Xeos, it's a compliment when people find multiple ways to win a map. In fact, to me the most important aspect of a map is that it should offer numerous ways to win.
This map gets a rare 10/10 from me and it's one of my favorite PAC maps yet. I eagerly anticipate the next challenge you throw at us.
Wow cheers for that :) I put a lot of effort into to making it interesting and I hope I achieved that. Hubs helped me out with a script for the Runner Nest so thanks to him too else it wouldn't be up :)
I've got too many ideas for my own good ha ha !
cheers again
Quote from: Xeos on January 09, 2015, 04:20:39 PM
"...Drag a field straight ..."
FINALLY!
I figured out how to use that dad-gummed "Field" thing.
I've clicking and clacking on that icon for two days and nothing worked.
Thanks - playing it now.
H
Quote from: Xeos on January 09, 2015, 04:20:39 PM
The start sequence can be done like this...
This is the start sequence explained....
Spoiler
Step 1: From the emitter, Drag a field straight up towards the PZ through the Totem- lay down lots of digitalis and when the wall goes lay down more digitalis to get the first pz with another emitter
Step 2: Support the first emitter and then get the Totem on the left - You will need to play with the field to get this.
Step 3: Switch the support to the second emitter and using the now more powerful field, take the cannons up through the middle
Hope that helps :)
Spoiler
I did part of your Step 1, then used a spore tower to get around the cannons to the relay, cutting power to the cannons. That was after many restarts - haha! I just dragged straight up through the totem, let the creeper build up behind the wall, then it flooded up the field into the PZ. That's the only way I could get started.
Great map, Xeos! Thank you so much. :) Now I can replay it and try different ways to get going. :D
Quote from: Xeos on January 09, 2015, 05:35:55 PM
Quote from: UrMawMah on January 09, 2015, 05:18:54 PM
this map is a sweet puzzle- sweet enough to get me onto these forums. I do this thing that I don't know if it's a thing or not on PAC maps and was wondering if it's just me-
Spoiler
I start a digital track over open space with a spore, load it up to 10-15 depth, and smash the T button twice to delete the creeper, dump it into space, and then start re-forming it into more spread out digitalis
That method is necessary to do the map but no one has done it quite like I wanted them too ha ha. The spores are so hard to predict how they are going to be used and where because whilst you can control their use to a point, there is always someone who finds another way :) Like you ! ha ha
Glad you enjoyed it though. I t makes the hours and hours it takes to make it and test it worthwhile .. 8)
Yeah, i've found you can pull off some seriously shifty shenanigans with scarcely sufficient spores and slick field strategies.
Once again though, kudos on the map!
Finally finished it, but am simply amazed at some of the scores.
With CW2, really great players would sometimes post videos of their game play, and I would like to see some of the techniques in use here.
Thanks for a fun-filled bunch of hours.
H
Quote from: Helper on January 10, 2015, 10:00:22 AM
Finally finished it, but am simply amazed at some of the scores.
With CW2, really great players would sometimes post videos of their game play, and I would like to see some of the techniques in use here.
Thanks for a fun-filled bunch of hours.
H
Glad you liked it Helper :) It also amazes me with some of the scores too ! I have no idea how they do it and would love to watch a video too :)
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 10:02:53 AM
Quote from: Helper on January 10, 2015, 10:00:22 AM
Finally finished it, but am simply amazed at some of the scores.
With CW2, really great players would sometimes post videos of their game play, and I would like to see some of the techniques in use here.
Thanks for a fun-filled bunch of hours.
H
Glad you liked it Helper :) It also amazes me with some of the scores too ! I have no idea how they do it and would love to watch a video too :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2weWBCXy3_Q&feature=youtu.be
...Anything for my fans!
Well, you might not really be fans, I might not have any fans at all, but the narcissist in me demands it.
Also, I shaved five minutes off in this run.
Quote from: UrMawMah on January 10, 2015, 11:34:49 AM
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 10:02:53 AM
Quote from: Helper on January 10, 2015, 10:00:22 AM
Finally finished it, but am simply amazed at some of the scores.
With CW2, really great players would sometimes post videos of their game play, and I would like to see some of the techniques in use here.
Thanks for a fun-filled bunch of hours.
H
Glad you liked it Helper :) It also amazes me with some of the scores too ! I have no idea how they do it and would love to watch a video too :)
...Anything for my fans!
Well, you might not really be fans, I might not have any fans at all, but the narcissist in me demands it.
Also, I shaved five minutes off in this run.
Just watched it and thanks for doing it. Good time too ! Watching that has given me an insight into a good players mindset in approaching a map like this and will help me build better maps. So thanks again for doing it and great play ;D
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 11:48:52 AM
Quote from: UrMawMah on January 10, 2015, 11:34:49 AM
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 10:02:53 AM
Quote from: Helper on January 10, 2015, 10:00:22 AM
Finally finished it, but am simply amazed at some of the scores.
With CW2, really great players would sometimes post videos of their game play, and I would like to see some of the techniques in use here.
Thanks for a fun-filled bunch of hours.
H
Glad you liked it Helper :) It also amazes me with some of the scores too ! I have no idea how they do it and would love to watch a video too :)
...Anything for my fans!
Well, you might not really be fans, I might not have any fans at all, but the narcissist in me demands it.
Also, I shaved five minutes off in this run.
Just watched it and thanks for doing it. Good time too ! Watching that has given me an insight into a good players mindset in approaching a map like this and will help me build better maps. So thanks again for doing it and great play ;D
Yeah man, it's not a problem. I'll record the hell out of my plays if that's what you want. These PAC maps are great, especially the smaller size ones, they're usually more puzzle-ey and i'm not above playing them a half dozen times or so to bump up my speed some. (you know, by prodding the weaknesses and doing those things you really don't intend ;))
If you ask me, the beginning was definitely the best part- if you don't get the timing just right, and place the field just perfectly, it stalls quickly to an unbeatable point, and since it's the beginning, and it's quick to tell when it's stalled to the unbeatable, resetting a few times doesn't lead to much heartbreak.
*EEEEEEEE* he called me a good player!!! *EEEEEE*
Right - well I challenge you to play it and you can't place a spore until you reach the most northern PZ . When you have taken that, you can take the spider. After that you can do what you want :)
Tell me how you get on ;)
That's how I intended it to be played :)
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 01:19:59 PM
Right - well I challenge you to play it and you can't place a spore until you reach the most northern PZ . When you have taken that, you can take the spider. After that you can do what you want :)
Tell me how you get on ;)
That's how I intended it to be played :)
CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJmabtr_XeQ&feature=youtu.be
It took me 16 minutes to get that PZ, I could shave a few more minutes off of it, but I covered it and gave up; that's so not the most efficient way to do it!
Taking that runner farm and shuffling the creep around that much are just super huge time sinks.
Quote from: UrMawMah on January 10, 2015, 02:47:10 PM
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 01:19:59 PM
Right - well I challenge you to play it and you can't place a spore until you reach the most northern PZ . When you have taken that, you can take the spider. After that you can do what you want :)
Tell me how you get on ;)
That's how I intended it to be played :)
CHALLENGE ACCEPTED!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJmabtr_XeQ&feature=youtu.be
It took me 16 minutes to get that PZ, I could shave a few more minutes off of it, but I covered it and gave up; that's so not the most efficient way to do it!
Taking that runner farm and shuffling the creep around that much are just super huge time sinks.
Loved watching that and seeing it played exactly how I designed it . I loved the way you managed the digitalis. Thanks for taking on the challenge. I will certainly need to be more aware of the talent out there playing this game ! 8)
I have a few more sneaky tricks if you want me to share them (privately, so as not to ruin any surprises) to make even more absurd puzzle maps.
I finally got around to playing this map and loved it! Great puzzle map! The stacked beams were pretty cool...never thought to do that. What did you intend to use the runners for? They didn't really help me with anything.
Quote from: Hubs on January 10, 2015, 04:39:16 PM
I finally got around to playing this map and loved it! Great puzzle map! The stacked beams were pretty cool...never thought to do that. What did you intend to use the runners for? They didn't really help me with anything.
Well.... The runners were intended to be used as UrMawMah played it in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJmabtr_XeQ&feature=youtu.be - You will see I put 2 collectors right on the corner. I put them there so that the runners would take them out, cutting the power to that zone and therefore allowing the creep to be pushed through and take it out. But I underestimated peoples desire to dominate maps using spore which makes it difficult to design good puzzle maps when I want the player to push creep around an area in a certain way. I thought about having the player limited to how many spores they can place and that would give me many more options. I posted a request in the coders corner to see if that is easy to do. Then I could have some serious fun :)
Glad you played it and liked it and thanks again for your help :)
Interesting. I didn't think of that and didn't even go up that way initially. I took the entire right side before venturing above the middle base. Once I had all the PZs from the right base the left was a cakewalk.
Quote from: Hubs on January 10, 2015, 06:55:57 PM
Interesting. I didn't think of that and didn't even go up that way initially. I took the entire right side before venturing above the middle base. Once I had all the PZs from the right base the left was a cakewalk.
Yes it appears UrMahWah also did that too ( before he did the video above) . Pushing creep across the void makes it hard to defend against that as its so easy to do... Been thinking about strategies to stop that when using a void...
You could put a thin strip of land in the void next to an island. The creeper would stop there and not connect to the island
but wont it just go over it?
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 07:37:55 PM
but wont it just go over it?
void is effectively 500 height, so the C can "pour" onto land of any height but needs to be 500 plus to "pour" off!
Quote from: teknotiss on January 10, 2015, 08:10:03 PM
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 07:37:55 PM
but wont it just go over it?
void is effectively 500 height, so the C can "pour" onto land of any height but needs to be 500 plus to "pour" off!
Ok I didn't know that. Thanks for telling me :)
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 08:11:19 PM
Quote from: teknotiss on January 10, 2015, 08:10:03 PM
Quote from: Xeos on January 10, 2015, 07:37:55 PM
but wont it just go over it?
void is effectively 500 height, so the C can "pour" onto land of any height but needs to be 500 plus to "pour" off!
Ok I didn't know that. Thanks for telling me :)
no worries man, happy to help! 8)
I'm pretty sure you can adjust the 500 setting too.
oh almost certainly, but that'd be out of my field of expertise, one for the code monkeys! ::) ;)
I've found a way that seems to work that gets me the result I want without doing any coding. I will be releasing the map again soon and see how they get on :)