This topic is for discussion of map #594: Helm's Deep
(http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld3/queryMaps.php?query=thumbnailid&id=594)
Author: stdout
Size: 250x250
Desc:
Can you hold the keep long enough for help to arrive? And if help does arrive, will it be enough? Against all odds battle the evil forces of Sarumon in this epic recreation of the battle from The Two Towers. #crpl #ACassist
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Lol, this is funny to me because I got left and right mixed up in the emergency room recently. :{P
I realized my error after I had made the map and by that point I was not going to fix it. :)
Quote from: Flabort on May 28, 2014, 02:02:42 AM
Lol, this is funny to me because I got left and right mixed up in the emergency room recently. :{P
Sure hope you were the patient and not the medical type!
;)
Playing now - looks like a good one.
Great map. Really enjoyed playing that one.
I'm glad you enjoyed it. Judging from the ratings being left, it looks like a lot of others liked it, too.
I had the idea to make a Helm's Deep recreation while reading the CRPL tutorial. I thought it would be awesome to have help come from the side of the battle and come down and enter the big battle arena. Making Gandalf be a new friendly unit that walks into the sea of enemies just sounded pretty awesome to me. The extra emitters on the side, as well as your own units following him down the mountain represent the Rohirrim. In playing the map, certain emotions rise in the player and that makes me feel like I accomplished my goal.
If I had to do it again I would make Gandalf move quicker. As it is, it feels like it takes him too long to walk down the mountain. It also would have been neat to make all the creeper turn to attack Gandalf once he makes his appearance. Friendly runners would have been pretty cool to represent Rohirrim.
Anyway, I had fun and learned how to use CRPL so maybe I'll make other fun maps like this in the future.
There were just too many runners and not enough AC in the beginning. Energy wasn't a problem, but the insane amounts of digitalis, creeper, and spores as well as the lack of Berthas and ridiculously high cost of Nullifiers made the map really hard. Still, it was pretty fun, and the timed anti-emitters and Gandalf were very nice.
Quote from: Asbestos on May 28, 2014, 06:21:12 PM
There were just too many runners and not enough AC in the beginning.
This map is nearly a speedrun candidate and a lot of fun.... You have free access to large numbers of Totems, high ground and gimmes in the form of the nearby spore towers that you can take out for PZs. Hard it ain't. Fun - yea!
And Gandalf was ingenious... I actually ended up making an army that followed (or ran a little ahead) of him.
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 28, 2014, 12:15:24 AM
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Actually from the east appears to be correct. from all the maps I can find Helms deep faces north. Technically Mordor is east of Helms deep but must go north and attack to the south.
Quote from: Asbestos on May 28, 2014, 06:21:12 PMthe insane amounts of digitalis, creeper, and spores as well as the lack of Berthas and ridiculously high cost of Nullifiers made the map really hard.
If you watch the movie you'll see that it was basically a hopeless battle with an overwhelming horde of orcs using war machines to destroy the defenders. The battle is basically lost and they are about to give up when Gandalf finally arrives and turns the tide of the battle.
So that was my intention. You as the player were supposed to feel completely overwhelmed by enemies. Just when things get nearly impossible, Gandalf (and company) shows up and saves the day.
Somehow a few people are beating the map before Gandalf shows up. That is very impressive.
Quote from: stdout on May 28, 2014, 09:05:59 PM
Somehow a few people are beating the map before Gandalf shows up. That is very impressive.
Use some of the PZs for energy, rush the nearest Spore towers and it's not much of a battle after that. Probably winnable without Gandalf's support. :)
Still fun, though.
Fun map. Thanks! You can beat the map before Gandalf shows up. In fact, you can beat it *before* the first massive spore wave shows up.
I did it in about 5 minutes though I'm sure someone will come along and do better.
But I also did it the long way too just for the fun of it.
Definitely a speed run candidate. Gandalf was interesting, but totally irrelevant for my victory. (my assault on the inhibitor was well ahead of him and the AC never came into play.)
As for the army of runners
Spoiler
they are easily contained by using some of those power zones for strafers.
Quote from: chwooly on May 28, 2014, 08:32:11 PM
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 28, 2014, 12:15:24 AM
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Actually from the east appears to be correct.
No, North is always the top of the map. East is always to the right, West to the left. (Does not apply in imaginary Universes.)
Quote from: Helper on May 31, 2014, 08:19:55 AM
Quote from: chwooly on May 28, 2014, 08:32:11 PM
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 28, 2014, 12:15:24 AM
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Actually from the east appears to be correct.
No, North is always the top of the map. East is always to the right, West to the left. (Does not apply in imaginary Universes.)
As there is no legend there is no way to know what north is except by looking at the map and orienting it to the terrain, Based on previous maps of Helms Deep the map is actually upside down and from the east is correct.
Quote from: chwooly on May 31, 2014, 11:03:47 AM
Quote from: Helper on May 31, 2014, 08:19:55 AM
Quote from: chwooly on May 28, 2014, 08:32:11 PM
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 28, 2014, 12:15:24 AM
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Actually from the east appears to be correct.
No, North is always the top of the map. East is always to the right, West to the left. (Does not apply in imaginary Universes.)
As there is no legend there is no way to know what north is except by looking at the map and orienting it to the terrain, Based on previous maps of Helms Deep the map is actually upside down and from the east is correct.
On the computer we normally consider north to be up.
When looking from the point of view of those in the fortress, Gandalf and his army do come from the east.
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 31, 2014, 01:02:14 PM
Quote from: chwooly on May 31, 2014, 11:03:47 AM
Quote from: Helper on May 31, 2014, 08:19:55 AM
Quote from: chwooly on May 28, 2014, 08:32:11 PM
Quote from: Loren Pechtel on May 28, 2014, 12:15:24 AM
Help from the east? I got no help from the east. I got a nice pile of anti-creeper from the west, though.
Actually from the east appears to be correct.
No, North is always the top of the map. East is always to the right, West to the left. (Does not apply in imaginary Universes.)
As there is no legend there is no way to know what north is except by looking at the map and orienting it to the terrain, Based on previous maps of Helms Deep the map is actually upside down and from the east is correct.
On the computer we normally consider north to be up.
Which would apply here as well if previous knowledge did not contradict that convention and prove it wrong in this case.
Haha didn't really have an overwhelmed experience since long before Gandalf showed up I had already pushed all the way to the final inhib but was still a fun map.
If you ever make any edits all I would do is get rid of the walkers, make a lot more creeper especially closer to the walls and make the spores a bit stronger.
The only time I was a bit worried was when the first massive spore wave came.
Stumbled on this map-and yes, it is definitely possible to beat before Gandalf does anything.
Spoiler
Basically...don't try to advance head on. Instead, spend the first minute or two purely on developing energy-be SURE to connect to the powerzoned reactors ASAP. land one command node near the lone powerzone to spread your network faster (I put a collector in it for VERY quick energy).
Then...keep making energy in the safe regions, while advancing your network south along the Gandalf ridge.
Head straight towards the inhibitor with massive waves of mortars+blasters; you can optionally build some strafers if you want.
Even if you don't speedrun the map, its' VERY doable thanks to the absolutely MASSIVE number of PZs you have for early energy, followed up by an absolutely MASSIVE area that's easy to defend you can use for ridiculous energy generation.