What are the opening moves in the map, and what should I do to secure my positions?
(besides connecting things around with relays on the border dias-things...)
First thing to say is that you'll probably need to pause this map to issue orders - it moves quite quickly and events can easily get away from you.
Other than that, here is how I do it.
Spoiler
Start bottom right, grab the resource packs, nuke the runner nests, cut the digitalis, use the PZ's to extend the range of your Nullifiers.
Quote from: Cavemaniac on January 18, 2014, 01:30:13 PM
First thing to say is that you'll probably need to pause this map to issue orders - it moves quite quickly and events can easily get away from you.
Other than that, here is how I do it.
Spoiler
Start bottom right, grab the resource packs, nuke the runner nests, cut the digitalis, use the PZ's to extend the range of your Nullifiers.
here's how i do it...
a: play for a bit.... rage quit
b: rinse and repeat for a bit... say three times...
c: swear at the PC, game and Cave then promise myself i will do it one day....
d: come back to it a few weeks later, start at "a:" ::)
love this map, still can't do it yet, i know i
can but i keep failing to save after getting safe, or keep wasting time..
curse you cave! love the map dude! 8)
Mmmmmm.
Unfortunately by the time I made this map I'd been a beta testing CW3 for nearly a year and I suspect that I made it a bit harder than most people would like - I made it to a difficulty that I found challenging!
This seems to be true for most of my maps, if the number of scores submitted for my Alpha Sector maps is anything to judge by...
::)
by who? :o
I did it map yesterday after this topic I was curious about it.
Great map, nicely done. When I saw 1st spore attack - "wow".
Beginning is very important so I restarted like 4 times before spores even build.
My tips that are useful not only in this map:
1) Defending flat land with cannons takes power and power starving can make you loose land. Better is to build wall and if needed protect it with mortar.
2) If you need take care of digitals switch option at your cannons.
3) Nullifier have bigger range in power zone.
4) Land with 3 Commands centres to have more power.
I landed in other place than Cave.
This was a very difficult map for me. I finished about 3/4 of Cavemaniac's maps, most on the first try (then I wiped out my saved game directory so I am starting again now), but this map I had to try about ten times.
General hint: Make sure you use all your energy packets, do not let the energy bar in the command nodes fill up completely. This map is in my experience more unforgiving than others.
Comment 1 above is interesting. I used cannon all the time and did not terp. Energy was indeed an issue. I should try building a wall and see whether that's easier.
My opening moves:
Spoiler
I start bottom left with three command nodes. Get energy resource pack and empty it out fast before creeper arrives; use it to build reactors and nullifier which destroys both enemy in corner and one to the right of it (I think they are a spore tower and a runner nest).
I've never thought to Terp - I rely on PC and AC - but I should give it a go. With how flat the landscape is a '1' high wall will be very effective.
Very pleased that people are trying and succeeding with different start positions - I hate being forced to play in just one way.
With this map I specifically wanted a map that allowed the use of PZ's to extend the use of Nullifiers.
The Thor unit showed up right at the end of developing this map so I included it to speed up the end game - it was a bit of a grind to mop up without it, though perfectly possible.
For another awkward Cavemaniac map, try my personal favourite - The Bardel Redemption.
You don't need high wall. '4' like pillars with PZ is ok.
About Terp. Terp in PZ is 3 times faster and cheaper.
Spoiler
I landed top left. 1 of command had pillar with resources in range to set syphon. With it I build nullifier, 5 cannons, spryer and terp and 2 power stations. When nullifier fires I set Terp at back PZ and canon in front switched to digitals. With terp I set '4' high wall from top to pillar and from left to pillar. End game is that you want to cut off 4 "sectors" for you. At digitals path near PZ in our "wall" I set platforms(3x3 at '4') for 2 cannons so You can set something different in PZ and it won't be destroyed by digitals. When spores time incoming you get off Terp and set Beam in PZ. When properly done you have your own ground base and "green" energy for spore attack
@Cave -
I will try that map 'The Bardel Redemption' tho probably at Sunday. You will see my time if I do it for sure :)E: I played 'The Bardel Redemption' and it's great map. Some crazy fun stuff.
Finally successfully completed leapfrog, very hard map,
Spoiler
What I did:
1. land cn bottom right where there is a cut in the digitalis, this cut in digitalis is important to avoid some of the problems with runners.
2. build some collectors, I used only collectors and no relays in this map.
3. build siphons very important to get early defenses built
4. build ore mine + sprayer + 2 blaster
5. the creeper starting to damage cn
6. build nullifier on closest spore tower to nullify it.
7. put blaster on powerzone and it will kill creeper, and switch to digitalis to kill nearby digitalis
8. begin building some reactors, once reactors are up, the starting base will be able to better survive, but still there is difficulty
9. at this point the siphons died from the digitalis, but with reactors up and some anticreeper support,
10. continue building some reactors one at a time
11. build the costlier stuff, at least one terp and one sniper and one mortar
12. now there is energy to consider removing the blaster from the powerzone, but have at least 3 to 4 beams,
as the phantoms will start coming in large waves put a beam on powerzone to help kill the phantoms.
13. terp a wall of height 1 on the sides of base to use mortar for defense there do not terp anywhere there is digitalis,
but also give yourself the bottom right 4 squares
14. continue pushing to secure the base better by nullifying more stuff
15. now terp the rest of the walls, it might be helpful to terp platforms for some blasters to gain an advantage,
use that to kill digitalis to rebuild siphons, that was a 30 minute tough fight to get there for me
16. now most of the base is better secure build mortars to defend walls, at this point 3-4 mortars on the map is enough.
17. fight to nullify a few more stuff.
18. once your reach the totem, start making space and building forge
19. the aether siphon will give you to research 1 in all 9 techs
20. at this point you should have a secure base, fighting to nullify the left emitter and using a digitalis enabled blaster
you can now put 2 beams on powerzones and save lots of energy
21. now with forge techs coming in, begin fighting for and making space to build thor
22. build and fully charge the thor while it is disarmed,
23. with a fully charged thor you can now devastate the creeper and win the map.
Yay! Finally got LeapFrog with the advice found here in the forum.
Spoiler
FWIW, I had success starting in the upper left corner but not the lower right corner. If you can get established enough to terp the area advised in two earlier comments & survive the first spore wave (or two), you're well on your way to beating the map. Initially, I saved after each small victory so if things went south, I could go back & load a save & correct where I went wrong. Which kind of goes without saying but I said it anyway. :D
Thanks to all!
Now, off to tangle with Runner Wash. Got some excellent advice for that one as well so I have hope again. :) We'll see...
Quote from: Nephthys on July 16, 2014, 12:39:55 AM
Yay! Finally got LeapFrog with the advice found here in the forum.
Yay!
Congratulations!
Quote from: Cavemaniac on July 16, 2014, 05:05:50 AM
Yay!
Congratulations!
TYVM! No luck with Runner Wash though. But I almost have a foothold in Bardel Redemption. The key word being "almost". :) Headed there now.
EDIT: Off topic but I managed to beat Bardel Redemption. YayRah! That puppy was tough for me! Can't say I'm proud of the time but I beat the *colorful language* thing! But not before the attached screenshot gave me a heart attack! Hmm... don't know how to mark an attached file as a spoiler. So I'll just:
PLEASE CONSIDER THE ATTACHED SCREENSHOT A SPOILER. YOU WERE WARNED. LOL I know you can see the thumbprint, but this is the best my lame self can do! sorry!Cavemaniac, if you're around, did that
Spoiler
explosion of creeper off the digi line happen bc I took forever or does it happen when you TRY to nullify the Spawn Tower or DO nullify one of the top Emitters? I almost cried 'til I thought of a way around it. Did you hear me cussing you? P.S. I miss G.
Thanks for the fun maps CaveManiac! Of course, they're only fun when I can beat them. Lots of Triangles of Failure left in your section. :-\
Quote from: Nephthys on July 16, 2014, 05:57:35 PM
Quote from: Cavemaniac on July 16, 2014, 05:05:50 AM
Yay!
Congratulations!
TYVM! No luck with Runner Wash though. But I almost have a foothold in Bardel Redemption. The key word being "almost". :) Headed there now.
EDIT: Off topic but I managed to beat Bardel Redemption. YayRah! That puppy was tough for me! Can't say I'm proud of the time but I beat the *colorful language* thing! But not before the attached screenshot gave me a heart attack! Hmm... don't know how to mark an attached file as a spoiler. So I'll just:
PLEASE CONSIDER THE ATTACHED SCREENSHOT A SPOILER. YOU WERE WARNED. LOL I know you can see the thumbprint, but this is the best my lame self can do! sorry!
Cavemaniac, if you're around, did that Spoiler
explosion of creeper off the digi line happen bc I took forever or does it happen when you TRY to nullify the Spawn Tower or DO nullify one of the top Emitters? I almost cried 'til I thought of a way around it. Did you hear me cussing you? P.S. I miss G.
Thanks for the fun maps CaveManiac! Of course, they're only fun when I can beat them. Lots of Triangles of Failure left in your section. :-\
Hur hur!
Don't worry, Karsten seems to have picked up the mantle where it comes to moving OFF TOPIC posts!
The massive blast of creeper you saw is what happens when Digitalis withers and the creeper is released - particularly over void.
With all my maps, pause, pause, and pause again - few of them should be attempted in real time!!
so @Bardel Redemption
Spoiler
It happens when you nullify center emitter as top emitter is close but not in digi web. Good to see that you got it!
(http://i.imgur.com/yFzLCsJ.jpg)
Took me a few tries at that opening.
That how i always start too, lol.
As my strategy was a little different, that is what I did until the first spore attac:
1 - Grab a "Mass"-artifact (using the 3rd command node which I moved afterwards)
2 - Start at the top left corner
3 - Fire the artifact on the emitter to the south in order to secure that line by getting a creeper pond which is easy to mortar
4 - Build 4 siphons (I didn't know before that they can overlap each other ... ::)), 4 cannons, mortar, sprayer and ore mine
5 - Nullify the top left spore tower together with the runner nest to the right
6 - Build a reactor into the left PZ and put a digitalis cannon in the 2nd PZ
7 - Build 10 Beams
--- Spore attac ---
8 - Build Forge and siphon aether (spent it on 4 lvls energy and 1 lvl fire rate)
I tried the lower right 8 times or so because I liked the idea of taking on the end of the digitalis ribbon, but I just couldn't get going enough before the spores started raining down. Upper left worked better for me and is how I won the map. You have more time to siphon before the creep encroaches, which was critical for getting reactors online. Nice tip from Mefi on the value of walls for the early game.
Attached are screens of my setup 2 mins in and 5 mins in.