This topic is for discussion of map #1850: Multipule Difficulties (Not the Way you think) (http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld2/viewmaps.php?mapid=1850)
(http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld2/thumb.php?id=1850) (http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld2/viewmaps.php?mapid=1850)
Author: Angel (http://knucklecracker.com/creeperworld2/viewmaps.php?author=Angel)
Desc:
Not your average multipule difficulties :)
You probably know more about map making than 90% of the people here. I wish that was all I could say about your maps. Usually (and even in this case) it is relatively easy to finish your maps once one has played through the map and stumbled into every trap and trick that you laid out.
I still wonder glitch you used in this map to force the drones to be stationery at the bottom. That again hid a trap, which I stumbled into in my last attempt to finish this map. Now of course, I can restore my save, go through all the meticulous steps to free up my LS and move it somewhere safe before I blow up the Nexus... but I think I'm done here.
;D ;D ;D So many traps ;D ;D ;D I told y'all to save after every chamber :P Get trolled :D
"trolling" people that you will want to play maps in future is probably unwise. ::) they may decide to not play. ;)
personally i didn't feel trolled, or tricked, or trapped, just bored.
you have made maps i really enjoyed, but this one was just a rinse and repeat nightmare for way to long to be interesting for me.
however if you intended to make a map that's a chore to play, well done success ;)
spent 2 weeks putting that map together, killing the nexus once :'( had to put something in to entertain myself and watch, 5, 6 scores and bout 200 downloads.....it was just a simple map of, see a jammer, hold down 'r' and scan the map. :) I even said, "Save your game after every chamber." Just a map of tricks that i made. Like all my maps, VERY HARD
@Angel -
Somehow you continue to miss the message that so many people are trying to tell you. As a general rule, your maps aren't "hard", they are boring.
The thumbs up/down indicators are not necessarily a reliable gauge for individual games, but when the vast majority of any map maker's games are resoundingly "Thumbs Down" he should start getting the message.
You have demonstrated the ability to create some fun maps and - for the life of me - I can't figure out why you continue to submit stuff like this.
Quote from: Helper on January 04, 2013, 05:36:29 AM
@Angel -
Somehow you continue to miss the message that so many people are trying to tell you. As a general rule, your maps aren't "hard", they are boring.
That's a bit harsh. Many of Angel's map are brilliant, and show a remarkable insight into the game mechanics on a level that has not been exhibited. by many other players.
In the specific case of this map, if one does as he suggests and save at least once per room, the map can be played and completed - I think. My observation was that I've fallen into too many of the traps and have lost the will to conquer. I have actually reached the point where, if I had positioned my LS in a different location, I would have won. But I didn't, due to one of those traps and I'm not going to try again, because it needs replaying to a foregone conclusion - and a bunch of my time, which I want on another map.
Along the same lines, he has a map in approval now, that seems very, very tricky. But I"m not sure I'm even going to attempt that map, since it seems very dependant on micro-management and based on his time it is a very long map. And I'd rather not fight on that particular battlefront, as is my right to choose.
TL;DR. Angel has made some awesome maps and should look at constructive criticism and look at us players as his customers, rather than hating on us... :)
Helper, the map flat out ticked me off -.-
I spent along time on that map, doing the same chambers 10, 20, 30 times. So yes, it did bore me after a while. But i still put it up. Some of my maps are boring, yes, they require some patience to complete. And once again, if you see my 'jammer' up, hold down 'r', can the map :)
And krasten, i try to make my maps hard and unique, each one having a different theme and different way to solve. All require patience and some thinking put into them.
Quote from: Angel on January 04, 2013, 06:11:57 PM
Helper, the map flat out ticked me off -.-
I spent along time on that map, doing the same chambers 10, 20, 30 times.
Several of the map makers have other CW members play their games to test them before submitting. A couple of the benefits of this are that you will get an honest (off-line) opinion of the game, and you will have someone with a fresh view of how it plays.
As the designer, you already know the methodology needed to win and if your testing parts of it 10, 20, 30 times it will be very hard to maintain any kind of perspective for how it will play for others.
I want to make 1 final word on the matter. I DON'T CARE HOW MANY PEOPLE THINK IT'S TOO HARD! (not mad btw, just want this to be read and realized.) My maps are hard. Don't like em, don't download em. So helper, one last thing, don't like em, don't play em when i submit it. If possible, let others do em. I'm sorry if that's mean, but i'm tired of people telling me my maps are boring. Live with it, your fault for trying it, expecting the same thing every time. You know you are. I'm sorry if its harsh, but seriously. THEY ARE HARD. Thank you for telling me what i could do to, like send it to others. But, i think for now, until one of them asks, i probably won't do it.
i'm going to have to stick my oar in again.
Angel, we aren't having a go at you, or about your maps, we are just trying to point out that what you think is hard is sometimes dull.
as map moderators we can choose to not play maps but the point of being a moderator is to moderate, so most of us at least try every map that's submitted.
you have submitted maps i think are hard and fun (an example is "#1812 The Creeper's Main Base (inside)" very interesting design and took some thought), but you have also submitted a few where you seem to think "hardness" is the same as "repetition".
you also have pretty hostile reactions to criticism, this isn't necessary, you don't have to take any advice at all, but try to remember that most people are trying to help, so just a thanks for the advice response is enough. you don't need to argue your position.
this "
Quote from: Angel on January 04, 2013, 07:51:11 PM
So helper, one last thing, don't like em, don't play em when i submit it. If possible, let others do em. I'm sorry if that's mean, but i'm tired of people telling me my maps are boring. Live with it, your fault for trying it, expecting the same thing every time. You know you are. I'm sorry if its harsh, but seriously. THEY ARE HARD. Thank you for telling me what i could do to, like send it to others. But, i think for now, until one of them asks, i probably won't do it.
" isn't a particularly useful or nice way to respond, try being pleasant, you'll get better reactions from people in all walks of life if you do.
so to sum up my position, some of your maps are hard, some are dull, but being angry that someone will tell you when they think a map is dull is not a good response.
take it easy dude, and remember most criticism is offered to help mappers improve, not to offend. 8)
And now... to avoid a thread in map discussion being locked, can we return to a discussion of the relative merits of *this* specific map?
Ok, maybe I'm retarded, but I can't figure out how to free the ship without killing it. Alittle help?
Quote from: lid73 on January 07, 2013, 05:23:06 PM
Ok, maybe I'm retarded, but I can't figure out how to free the ship without killing it. Alittle help?
The middle gateway in the bottom right sends dig packets every 3 seconds to destroy the 'x's at the top and diminish your power supply :)
But that opens four generators that kill the ship. I guess I'll have to put some more weapons up there to see if that does it.
Quote from: lid73 on January 08, 2013, 11:10:06 AM
But that opens four generators that kill the ship. I guess I'll have to put some more weapons up there to see if that does it.
Or put shields around the 'x's and fill the chamber with the LB with AC :)
How do you even start and get rid of the phantoms at the top?
Quote from: MUengineer on October 02, 2013, 03:37:58 PM
How do you even start and get rid of the phantoms at the top?
Smart use of energy and using one of the 3 "weapon/energy usage" on wepaons (deactivate and that stuff)
The challenging chambers aren't actually a problem. Difficult maps are enjoyable.
However, I still consider this map to be "not the best" because there is a luck-based feature:
- the super drone dispensed along with the AC phantom.
Once the super drone moves toward the LS before I'm able to move the LS, everything will be done for! There is no even a smallest thing to make sure it doesn't collide with the LS. Frequently saving doesn't help because the drone won't change the route once it's decided.
The super drone has ruined this game. It should never had existed. I dislike luck tries in CW2.