Author Topic: Question about land  (Read 173 times)

cpaca

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Question about land
« on: August 06, 2017, 09:06:26 pm »
How far is one "Land unit"?
Can we get estimates? 
If I remember correctly, the Origin World is in Codex. Perhaps an estimate based on that? But that is torn into pieces. Same for its moon. 
However, perhaps we could get an estimate based on CW3 ore? I believe there is ore, which we can assume is the same as CW3 ore for its color, is 6x6 units when it is 3x3 on CW3. 
With that, we could hypothetically connect its size relative to something within CW3. I will NOT be taking the assumption the emitters are the same in CW3 as CW2 - Anti-Emitters are white in CW2, and normal ones are blue [by default]. However, Anti-emitters are blue and SPIN in CW3, whilst being normal blue if it's normal. No comparison for CW1, no Anti's in CW1. 
Ok, that doesn't work. 
The Berthas size comparison and the Ore size comparison are weird for CW3. CW3 is NOT VIABLE. 
CW2 and CW1 are still comparable
« Last Edit: August 07, 2017, 06:07:05 pm by cpaca »
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GoodMorning

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2017, 09:08:07 pm »
You could start with the CW3:3x3 = PF 5x5 from the reactors in the story.

Alternatively, the size of a 256x256 image could give you some idea.
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12345ieee

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2017, 03:48:13 am »
For PF, the best estimate you can reasonably get is based on the fact that HQ has "crew quarters" in the blue section, which means it is roughly the same dimension of a normal warship.

Scale everything and you can get an estimate for the land.


For CW2, several people can stay in the fortified bunkers, so a tile is bunker-sized (10 meters or so, I'd say).
In CW1, Odin City has 100k people, scale this to a normal city, maybe 10x as compact.

CW3 at the moment eludes me.

cpaca

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2017, 06:09:13 pm »
Hmm. 
I found a good connection. 
12345ieee pointed out a way to have size in CW1.
CW1 also has totems, similar to PFE's totems. 
I will NOT consider those totems the same as the CW3 totems, as those make *aether* not *rift portals to places* 
I will make another reply when I make some calculations.
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cpaca

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2017, 06:34:56 pm »
CW1 totem is [approximately] 2x2. 
PFE totem is [approximately] 5x5. 

Odin city is [approximately] 6x6.
Space will be saved. New technology allows new, easier food for all the people. 
At the same time, rift engines and flying and holding blueprints and look at that city design. 
I'll just use the same density per person as the most dense US city that is not in a metropolitican area. This is important because the top 5 are New York City Metropolitican and all of them have under 100,000 people, and all of them besides Hoboken [50,005 people] have under 50,000 people. 
That puts me to using NYC. 27,016.3 people per square mile. 
100,000/27,016.3 = 3.7014 square miles. 
3.7014/36 square units = 0.1 square mile per square unit in CW1. 
0.1 square miles times 5 [PFE] divided by 2 [CW1] = 0.25 square mile per unit. 
This would mean [since each unit is square] that each unit is 0.5 square miles on each side. 
This would put omnis at 6.25 square miles. Huh.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2017, 11:16:13 pm by cpaca »
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Keeper Decagon

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2017, 06:35:55 pm »
I will NOT consider those totems the same as the CW3 totems, as those make *aether* not *rift portals to places* 

That's probably because Rift Space doesn't exist anymore by the time CW3 happens. A bit difficult to make a Rift portal without Rift Space existing. :P
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GoodMorning

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2017, 07:07:00 pm »
That's probably because Rift Space doesn't exist anymore by the time CW3 happens. A bit difficult to make a Rift portal without Rift Space existing. :P

Well, you can try*...
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cpaca

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2017, 11:34:16 pm »
That's probably because Rift Space doesn't exist anymore by the time CW3 happens. A bit difficult to make a Rift portal without Rift Space existing. :P

Well, you can try*...
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Relli

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #8 on: Today at 10:22:14 am »
CW1 also has totems, similar to PFE's totems. 
I will NOT consider those totems the same as the CW3 totems, as those make *aether* not *rift portals to places* 
I know I'm way late to the party on this one, but since no one else has said this, I feel like I should. The totems in CW3 are indeed identical to the ones in CW1. I double-checked the original Forge mission in CW3 to confirm this.
Lia: "Your people used Totems to open rifts into Rift-Space. But, Rift-Space was long ago destroyed, and the Ticons had a hand in that." (ooh, I'd forgotten that part)
"Totems were built by the Ticon people to produce Aether. Aether is formed from the remnants of Rift-Space, so Totems are able to extract it."
So it seems the Ticons learned how to create additional Totems. But considering they function basically the same way, I don't think it's too big a stretch to suggest that they'd be exactly the same size.
Now, I can't speak for Particle Fleet at all on this one, as they did not show up in the campaign, and thus have no characters describing what they are and how they work. But I'd still hazard that if they have the same image as the other two games, and they're still called Totems, they could easily be considered the same objects, and thus the same size. Especially since this would be before the Ticons made new ones.
If Totems are larger in PFE than in CW1/3, map-cell-wise, then perhaps that indicates that the scale has reduced in PFE, and each single cell of land takes up less space than a single cell in the CW series.

Dark Ambition

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #9 on: Today at 12:54:43 pm »
If Totems are larger in PFE than in CW1/3, map-cell-wise, then perhaps that indicates that the scale has reduced in PFE, and each single cell of land takes up less space than a single cell in the CW series.

I'm not sure about that. If you take the Loki Hive/Arc images and put it in a map the same size as Arca (180,140) and use the same image scale (5.3 for Loki, 5 for Arc parts) it's the exact same size with no difference.

The Totems in PF:E have a completely different image, alongside having just a general different style than the Ticon. Ticon are the technological bada**'s of humanity, so i'd assume they'd be able to make their totems much smaller and more efficient. I mean... they can turn entire planets into guns ffs, it's probably not that far fetched XD

Keeper Decagon

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #10 on: Today at 01:15:25 pm »
If Totems are larger in PFE than in CW1/3, map-cell-wise, then perhaps that indicates that the scale has reduced in PFE, and each single cell of land takes up less space than a single cell in the CW series.
I'm not sure about that. If you take the Loki Hive/Arc images and put it in a map the same size as Arca (180,140) and use the same image scale (5.3 for Loki, 5 for Arc parts) it's the exact same size with no difference.

That is, of course, assuming a cell in either game is the exact same size. Since we're never really given any consistent objects between PF and CW, apart from the Totem, there's no real way to tell whether or not one is truly larger or smaller than another.

Then again, there were objects in the final mission (such as the Bertha-looking guns and the Reactors that powered them) that could be assumed to be similar to those used in CW3, since image-wise they look identical. Since the Totems are a different style, thus assuming a different structure to the "normal" Totems, perhaps these other objects could be used for scale instead?
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Dark Ambition

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Re: Question about land
« Reply #11 on: Today at 01:34:34 pm »
If Totems are larger in PFE than in CW1/3, map-cell-wise, then perhaps that indicates that the scale has reduced in PFE, and each single cell of land takes up less space than a single cell in the CW series.
I'm not sure about that. If you take the Loki Hive/Arc images and put it in a map the same size as Arca (180,140) and use the same image scale (5.3 for Loki, 5 for Arc parts) it's the exact same size with no difference.

That is, of course, assuming a cell in either game is the exact same size. Since we're never really given any consistent objects between PF and CW, apart from the Totem, there's no real way to tell whether or not one is truly larger or smaller than another.

Then again, there were objects in the final mission (such as the Bertha-looking guns and the Reactors that powered them) that could be assumed to be similar to those used in CW3, since image-wise they look identical. Since the Totems are a different style, thus assuming a different structure to the "normal" Totems, perhaps these other objects could be used for scale instead?

There's also in the last level straight up CW3 reactors, which are huge.

Although the image itself seems ever so slightly bigger than it would if scaled properly, and the PF totem is smaller than last level reactor, while CW3 totem is bigger than last level reactor.

It seems more likely to me that Virgil just didn't really think about the scaling all that much, since it seems to be all over the place XD

I'm going to continue with my original belief on this, with the Hive being it's size, the ships being colossal, and the omnis being 6 square miles because, let's face it, that's just waay cooler XD (And then, saying the Bertha's in PF and CW3 the same size would make the Hive pretty small in comparison to this stuff [general comparison because still huge omg] which isn't so cool)

Honestly, I'm not sure i'm going to follow this thread much unless we get word from Virgil confirming or denying these, he's really the only credible source possible for this i'm sure.

edit: There's also the fact that i've already posted one map with with this, and the next is close to finished with the same scaling thing, so even if i'm wrong on this, it's kinda too late for me to go back and change things already :P so i'm staying with that assumption.
« Last Edit: Today at 01:43:02 pm by Dark Ambition »