Custom Map #1283: PACursor 4: Stargate. By: Heritor

Started by AutoPost, April 09, 2021, 08:54:17 AM

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RageCage

#15
Think this was a pretty meh map to be honest, was able to complete it in 23min but I think it's to much focus on the cursor part. Didn't really use any emitters/launchers from when i was at the dam until i destroyed the factory and used lanchers to get to the rift lab.

Quote from: Jican on April 09, 2021, 12:50:27 PM
This falls flat. First, there are locations you can not snake your way into There are some pipes that are completely closed, you will have to force your way in with blobs, skimmers, spores.

I think you missed that there is an opening between room 6 and 11. A small gap, you can see it in the map posted by heritor.



Binnes

Quote from: RageCage on April 09, 2021, 07:51:06 PM
Think this was a pretty meh map to be honest, was able to complete it in 23min but I think it's to much focus on the cursor part.

I enjoyed this map myself but I do agree with the too much cursor. I cleared the entire map 51 minutes using what looks like the intended route based on that numbered map that was posted, and I didn't place any launchers or emitters the entire map except for at the very beginning and to destroy the dam with blobs. Inside the "Base" it was too difficult to actually hold any ground anywhere because the AI connects through concrete walls and can shoot through them too, so anywhere I placed an emitter would just get nullified within a minute from across a wall anyway. It made no sense to try and hold any ground so I just cursored my way through the entire base destroying the runways, rockets, and berthas, and factory, and then just easily pushed through to the base.

I think not allowing connection/shooting through the concrete wall would be beneficial but of course would make this specific map too easy, so balancing layout or ai strength would be needed.

I wonder if the people complaining about it being a slog or too hard are trying to capture every room and keep it filled with creeper instead of just moving along and not caring the AI takes it back.

Durikkan

#17
I always end up on some sort of weird sequence break on these maps.  This time it was start-9-7-13-18-19, though there was some trying and failing on some other routes. 

Edit: Also, fun to see my stargates getting some use  ;D
I'm known as Auri in cw4.

Ionie

Gonna jump on the bandwagon about too much cursor here. The concrete walls cause that you can't secure area. Cannons and snipers shoot through it, nullifiers nullify through it, collectors can make a path through it... If you mess something up, and your cursor-area gets converted or something, you look back to keep going from an area you secured, only to see that your emitters have been nullified, due to cannons coming through the concrete walls, and you have to start again from pretty much the dam.

Looks like a neat maze, though the concrete walls ruins it, given how you can never establish a proper foothold.

CS Z

Quote from: heritor on April 09, 2021, 01:17:02 PM
Looking at the rest of the PAC maps, I do feel mine are the hardest - and I create them that way because it's what I myself enjoy (my favourite CW3 maps were yum234's CSM maps) and I find there's not many of them at the moment.



I enjoyed PACursor 3 minus the long sections with nothing to blow up - I especially didn't care for the winding maze at the end of that map.  I enjoyed this map until I literally got pushed completely out of #6 while in the middle of cursoring it.  The AI started producing WAY too many shields and with the TWO(!) airships overhead and orbitals (especially multiple Conversions being rained down on me) and the AC breeder in that section, it just stopped being fun.

Here's my recommendation:  Scan the map and check for creeper on each (X, Z) coordinate every 15 seconds (or a reasonable subset or less frequency if performance will be an issue).  If creeper is there, mark it internally as unusable by the AI even if a bit later, a shield or a unit clears the zone.  Every 5 minutes, clear the internal unusable map.  That way, the AI is less aggressive in areas where creeper has taken over BUT won't stay indefinitely out of those areas (might take 20-30 minutes for the AI to reclaim an area).  Otherwise the player can wind up in situations where they are pushed out of areas they completed AND get pushed completely out of areas they are currently trying to work through and therefore wind up back at the entrance to the base, which is basically what happened to me (and looks like many other people too).  I think such a change would provide a much more balanced approach that would be acceptable to most players.  You might have to play with the frequency of scans and resets to determine the right balance.

Also, my comment about PACursor 3 having long corridors with nothing to blow up also applies to this map.  Even if it is just a bunch of towers and pylons, watching them blow up is satisfying and makes having to slog through all the AC worth the effort.

Getting to the entrance of the base was quite simple (i.e. the first half of the map).  Everything about the base itself is a slog even with cursor power 20.  The difference in difficulty skyrockets upon entering the base.  That felt rather unbalanced to me.  PACursor 3 was about the same difficulty level for most of the map and therefore felt a lot more balanced overall.

ikkonoishi

10/s cursor power can blast through everything this map can throw at it. The toughest part of this map is the corridor of AC breeder near the dam. Once you can get past that its just a matter of pushing through to the factory and sieging down those two shield walls by the sweeper.

Ranger Von Danger


Snicker

Great map. first play took almost an hour game time. I did get lost on trying to find a path to yellow gates, i didnt see the small path in the wall between 11 and 6. With 19 being my northside it was hard seeing that hole. But that just made the launchers more useful to jump a wall or 2. Had fun the whole time. :}

For players having trouble, I found it to much time consuming trying to hold each room after clearing them out. the AI is smart enough to try to take back what it lost and it will take it back even if you leave like 7 emiters behind. GL HF

SteveCarlo

this was pretty brutal..    i got past the dam and cut off everything outside of the walls no problem  but it took me forever to get room #4 stable and spread to #5.  I was able to get to #6 but never really held it... I used it to get to  #11 and kill the berthas and  then wreck 12, 13, 14, & 15.. but i was never able to hold them either.    I tried to abandon #4 and just keep moving forward @ #6 but the AI hemmed me in.    11:00 + hours and its easting my lunch.


VolcanoSheep

#25
My god the Ai is crazy OP in this, I've been playing for 37 minutes and just got into room 4 and 2 minutes later they nullified my single emitter and converted the little creep I had using an orbital.

I think my biggest issues with this were the AI spamming orbitals quite literally every couple of minutes and the fact they could wreck you by nullifying or setting a shield through a wall that you couldn't do anything about.

VolcanoSheep

#26
Gave an attachment of how it ended for me, couldn't see anyway out. You put a lot of effort into your maps, but I guess they are simply just too hard for me. I'm only writing this to suggest maybe toning down on the orbitals a bit, it really did seem like the AI in my game had infinite use of them.

I had that entire square in front of the shield filled with creep, and I was breaking through as fast as I could, but then I got hit with a conversion, then rain, one after each other and it completely wiped me out.

Edit: just wanted to edit and say I went at it again and I was able to beat it this time with the liberal use of mesh which made retaking areas from conversion a lot faster. literally painted the entire map in mesh, was satisfying to beat that map though.

flamewolf393

I cant figure out any way to advance after crossing the chasm, between the berthas and the orbitals the base keeps my creeper well at bay no matter what i do

phischphood

Quote from: knightace on April 09, 2021, 03:17:40 PM
All stargates are linked; I'm not sure what they meant by closed off. I slogged through this map (<2 hours) and didn't have any that weren't connected to proper output locations.

That said; I didn't follow the strategy below. I get the complaint about being attacked by all sides and unable to hold ground...because my god the number of times I peaked back through what I held and muttered "No. No. No. No." shoving them back out again. Half my time was spent reclaiming. I think the worst of it was #4 - if I missed the anticreep breeder being retaken I had to dedicate minutes to reclaiming the territory again.

The route I took was:
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 9, 8, 7, 10, 6, 11, 12, 15, 13, 14, 17, 16, 18, 19

so...it's possible to take many routes; but it's a slog to hold whatever you take rather than work on a next puzzle. I'm very thankful the AI didn't swing behind me and recapture the badlands to the left...that would've been even more frustrating. Instead it completely ignored it.

I spent hours last night going around in circles, because I didn't see the 1 square gap between 6 and 11! Without that you can't get to the end

Freed

Got it done in 2h. I´m just not a big fan of these big ac-fields. Yeah, you can push through, but it just takes time. No Skill.
For everyone who needs a hand - just go directly to the fabric  and build some launcher there to kill the rift. That's it.