This topic is for discussion of map #494: Emergency Landing
(http://knucklecracker.com/particlefleet/queryMaps.php?query=thumbnailid&id=494)
Author: Sorrontis
Size: 256x360
Desc:
We arrived in this sector after an emergency jump. We should have remained in the previous sector.
Happy New Years!
Hints:
Spoiler
Act Fast
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Go Right
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Go Down
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Go Left
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Go Up
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Retake center
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Use omnis
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Tech is your friend
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Divide and conquer
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QuoteIf you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle.
Happy New Year Sorrontis!
Beat the bottom half and held the middle against all of the dopples and then the big ship came back, cue chaos, cue rage quit!
One to come back to!
Hahaha! That's great!
Edit, I'm keeping tabs on the scores given... It's dismal:
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Vote 1: 1
Vote 2: 1
Vote 3: 1
Vote 4: 1
Vote 5: 1
Spoiler
There's a ship pickup under your defense canon (it's a combatant ship)
I have not rated yet and once finished will no doubt rate high, it is an expert only map though and they never rate high.
I missed that pick up though, thanks, probably revisit this evening.
The map gave me an idea though. Is it possible to be able to have an on/off switch on the big gun. I got wiped because it was loading when the big ship came back. It could lead to a cool map where you have a fixed HQ that can't move and you have to defend it with guns which you have some control over. The base could be under attack from un-latheable ship spawners either side and you have to fight out to get the progeny-thingy emitter whilst defending the base.
Or a "win after X minutes" survival map, with no early finish. After that point, something critical changes, things become latheable (in practice) and the map can be won.
Quote from: GoodMorning on January 02, 2017, 07:09:07 AM
Or a "win after X minutes" survival map, with no early finish. After that point, something critical changes, things become latheable (in practice) and the map can be won.
I can do that!
Quote from: D0m0nik on January 02, 2017, 06:30:21 AM
[...]Is it possible to be able to have an on/off switch on the big gun. [...]
I wish, I really wish we could.. That and a range arc for allied guns.
Yeah I see about the range arc, the gun is currently without limitation with respect to range, is that right?
Just finished it, tough old fight. I took a long way round and:
Spoiler
Went up the leftt hand side with omnis to get the tanker tech top left, tales a few goes with all 12 omnis but not too hard.
For some reason then decided to attack from the left before noticng that the Progenoriebob can be taken with omnis. This was made easier as the enemy guns did not seem to hold much ammo and emptied very quickly
Overall good battle but your spoilers were very much needed!
I could make it much harder by simply placing the progenitoribob in the center of the cluster.
Lets not and say you did, if it weren't for the spoilers I don't know how long I would have tried to have held the center from the start.
An otherwise alright mission with some problems.
General thoughts:
I'm pretty sure this mission is mostly meant to be hard. That's fine if that's what you're into.
The ship designs are pretty ok overall. I didn't find the shark to be too particularly useful and the blast ships had little worth due to the layout of the map. As a big note, one of the blast ships has a different loadout than the others, but you can't know this until you build it. The combat ship and combat lathe are nice, but you don't need them to win the map. They do make the map easier though.
There's a hidden (redacted) under (redacted). I have no problem with hidden secrets, but a well executed hidden secret needs a clue. I would say that this is even more important for missions in a game genre that doesn't typically have hidden secrets. Even a subtle clue is good, but here there is just nothing.
Now those are issues, but here's the biggest issue on this map. Unless you have a certain graphical setting (particle coloring by health, defaults to off), you have no idea that there is a weak area you can clean out. There are no other clues to this fact, so it is not at all apparent that it's even an option. Unless you're just plain lucky, read the spoilers on this thread (I didn't), or just fail the mission repeatedly until you figure it out, it very much feels like the author of this level just throws sucker punch after sucker punch at you. Once you do figure it out, the rest of the level is tough, but relatively straight forward.
My Rating:
6/10
My times:
1 hour 40ish minutes first (successful) run
40ish minute second run
18:54.0 Third run (current record)
Difficulty:
Hard as nails.
Speed Run Hint:
Spoiler
You actually need very little to finish this level. On my last run, I did it with the fishnet, a trio of combatants, and 8 omnis. I'm pretty positive that it can be done even faster.
Thanks Colonel!
Good review. I'll admit the ship designs weren't great for this map. As for the two types of blast ships, I'm running the beta so I can see what ships look like before building them. I forgot that V did not yet push that update as standard.
As for the hidden ship pickup under the central cannon, there is a clue. You have to be very perceptive though. The base of the cannon is wider and different than usual :) But, that's minor, and I doubt most would notice.
Ohmy! Particle colour by health makes all the difference in my maps! I forgot about that setting.
Well, the blast ships weren't bad per se. They're just not particularly useful on this map because of the energy range constraints. On paper, they're useful for guarding an energy mine from stray particles, but that's just not something you need on this map. The exception is the one with the discharger. It's not a bad idea to park that guy near your best energy mine.
The problem with the shark is that the odd shape leads to a weakly protected bridge and it doesn't have very many guns for a ship with that size of a footprint. It's not a bad ship, but it's also just not a particularly good ship. Not once you get past the novelty value anyways.
The combatants are good though. In practice, they're suped up cruisers with energy tanks. I don't think I've ever seen someone say that they don't like cruisers and the energy tanks are very useful on this map.
Now that you mention the graphic and I'm looking for it specifically, I can spot it. I doubt very many people are intimate enough with the games graphics to even know that it's different.
To solve the particle color thing in the future, you should mention it in the mission description at a minimum. Alternatively, a dialog at the beginning of the mission. Something like:
"Sensor Officer: Sir, I advise we switch our readouts to show particle durability instead of speed. (Menu->Graphics->Particle Coloring->Health)"
Quote from: ColonelSandersLite on January 05, 2017, 08:36:56 PM
[...]
To solve the particle color thing in the future, you should mention it in the mission description at a minimum. Alternatively, a dialog at the beginning of the mission. Something like:
"Sensor Officer: Sir, I advise we switch our readouts to show particle durability instead of speed. (Menu->Graphics->Particle Coloring->Health)"
That's a good idea. I'll steal it!
It was given to you, and therefore cannot be stolen. In any case: "Borrowed (without permission), on a permanent basis."
Quote from: GoodMorning on January 05, 2017, 09:11:11 PM
It was given to you, and therefore cannot be stolen. In any case: "Borrowed (without permission), on a permanent basis."
Haha! Fair enough.
Sorry Sorrontis but also not a fan of the shark at all, it is literally a waste of space as it gets in the way and as a shark it should have a lot more bite! (Although I am a fan of it's aesthetics ;))
Quote from: D0m0nik on January 06, 2017, 01:28:16 PM
Sorry Sorrontis but also not a fan of the shark at all, it is literally a waste of space as it gets in the way and as a shark it should have a lot more bite! (Although I am a fan of it's aesthetics ;))
Actually. It makes for a great dopple ship ;)
Finished, not hard but long, and with a bit of starting trickery.
Spoiler
I gave up on the big gun, and just rammed the ship from behind when it came.
Also, the lifetimes on those tough-particle Emitters again make them easier to take with particle beams than actual guns.
I wonder what the end would be like if you actually attacked the top, rather than the Progenitor, but I can't be bothered replaying to find out. (Why is it there, by the way?)
Quote from: GoodMorning on March 03, 2017, 12:37:35 AM
Finished, not hard but long, and with a bit of starting trickery.
Spoiler
I gave up on the big gun, and just rammed the ship from behind when it came.
Also, the lifetimes on those tough-particle Emitters again make them easier to take with particle beams than actual guns.
I wonder what the end would be like if you actually attacked the top, rather than the Progenitor, but I can't be bothered replaying to find out. (Why is it there, by the way?)
The truth? It was too tough without the Prog.
I just tested, and the final base fell just as easily as the forefront Emitters.
Spoiler
Omnis to the sides (only for the cannons), then let the Doppels and the big ship sit in the middle being useless. Charge up, and have enough particle beams to hold the storm off an amped CombatLathe as it takes out the Emitters first, and the other structures later. Lifetimes mean that the perticles don't build up to fatal levels. Finally, retake the middle (ramming is quite satisfying), clean up the plasma, grab the other ship plans, mire everything, (completionism) and then lathe the Progenitor.
So I'm now interested in what ye who play for time did if not doing that to the Emitters?
The start was great.
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I figured out I could relocate after losing once. But if you wouldn't realize you can escape to the bottom right I imagine it would be very frustrating. Still, it's a hard mode map... I'm not sure a hint would or wouln't be warranted.
After that,
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I never bothered retaking the center as it wasn't needed. I would have liked to, bit of a victorious comeback after being chased off, but it would actually complicate things having to spend the energy to hold it, and having new doppels pop up at the top while fighting there. Better to just let the enemy sit on it and stay out of my way. Perhaps it would have been better if the doppels were built mid or top left? You couldn't get at them there at the start anyway but you could then wipe them before the final assault.
In the end,
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progenitors almost always seem like an anticlimax to me. There's a heavily defended enemy base, a load of emitters spewing particles, patrols, etcetera... and I just rush the side a couple of times with omnis and all of it falls. On one hand it feels like I've skipped part of the map, on the other hand it would feel like I'm being inefficient if I would ignore it and try it another way, and I don't like that either.
I find the best and most satisfying use of progenitors is to blow everything to hell once you finish the final assault and would otherwise get in a mop up phase.
But even with the criticism it's still a pretty good map, 7/10.